Formula 1

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Crazyskier
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Trader Pat wrote:
Mon Nov 22, 2021 2:03 pm
Crazyskier wrote:
Mon Nov 22, 2021 9:56 am
I don't wish to labour the point, but in my mind a wider principle is at play here, in that sports men and women should NOT be using their 'platform' to promote agendas, minority or otherwise, irrespective of how valid they may appear.

Secondly; though you may think that Lewis is achieving a 'wider good' by spreading a message of tolerance and inclusion, your view is through a Western lens.

It's both inappropriate and exceedingly arrogant in a Muslim state, to promote any kind of homosexuality whatsoever. They invited Lewis, et al to drive a car round their track, not lecture them on their values, morality or belief system! His arrogance is astounding.

CS

I half agree with you. When sports stars and celebs jump on their soap box they usually come across as complete hypocrites but in Hamilton's case I have to give him credit for doing what I said he wouldn't and proving me wrong :)

The prize for the biggest hypocrite of the week though must go to David Beckham? If I was English I'm not sure how I'd feel about the fact that the face of England's 2018 WC bid is now the face of the Qatar World Cup! Especially given what's he's said in the past about the vote being dodgy.
Indeed! He never was the sharpest tool in the box, but he's sold his soul there. His UNICEF role is what he should have focused on.

CS
greenmark
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Crazyskier wrote:
Mon Nov 22, 2021 2:39 pm
Trader Pat wrote:
Mon Nov 22, 2021 2:03 pm
Crazyskier wrote:
Mon Nov 22, 2021 9:56 am
I don't wish to labour the point, but in my mind a wider principle is at play here, in that sports men and women should NOT be using their 'platform' to promote agendas, minority or otherwise, irrespective of how valid they may appear.

Secondly; though you may think that Lewis is achieving a 'wider good' by spreading a message of tolerance and inclusion, your view is through a Western lens.

It's both inappropriate and exceedingly arrogant in a Muslim state, to promote any kind of homosexuality whatsoever. They invited Lewis, et al to drive a car round their track, not lecture them on their values, morality or belief system! His arrogance is astounding.

CS

I half agree with you. When sports stars and celebs jump on their soap box they usually come across as complete hypocrites but in Hamilton's case I have to give him credit for doing what I said he wouldn't and proving me wrong :)

The prize for the biggest hypocrite of the week though must go to David Beckham? If I was English I'm not sure how I'd feel about the fact that the face of England's 2018 WC bid is now the face of the Qatar World Cup! Especially given what's he's said in the past about the vote being dodgy.
Indeed! He never was the sharpest tool in the box, but he's sold his soul there. His UNICEF role is what he should have focused on.

CS
My thoughts exactly. Although his public life must be nearly 100% based on the judgements of his advisers, so maybe cut him some slack there.

Returning to the racing. Saudi looks fast and sweeping. Could be another Lewis win? Then its all down to Abu Dhabi. By all accounts Mercedes took their eye off the ball there last year. But this could be quite a dramatic conclusion to the season.
Trader Pat
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greenmark wrote:
Mon Nov 22, 2021 3:41 pm
Returning to the racing. Saudi looks fast and sweeping. Could be another Lewis win? Then its all down to Abu Dhabi. By all accounts Mercedes took their eye off the ball there last year. But this could be quite a dramatic conclusion to the season.
Saudi looks fast but the wild card could be its a brand new track. No data for the teams on what the surface is like on tyres etc... The long straight should suit the Merc especially if they have their magic rear wing on :)

The 2 point swing for Verstappen taking fastest lap at the weekend could be massive.
greenmark
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Trader Pat wrote:
Mon Nov 22, 2021 4:22 pm
greenmark wrote:
Mon Nov 22, 2021 3:41 pm
Returning to the racing. Saudi looks fast and sweeping. Could be another Lewis win? Then its all down to Abu Dhabi. By all accounts Mercedes took their eye off the ball there last year. But this could be quite a dramatic conclusion to the season.
Saudi looks fast but the wild card could be its a brand new track. No data for the teams on what the surface is like on tyres etc... The long straight should suit the Merc especially if they have their magic rear wing on :)

The 2 point swing for Verstappen taking fastest lap at the weekend could be massive.
Ah yes that damned fretting wing.
I hope Max plays fair at Saudi.
I wonder what the F1 hierarchy would prefer. A Prost/Senna 1st corner clash or string it out to Abu Dhabi and let them duke it out. I know which I would go for.
Trader Pat
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Hamilton priced very short for the Saudi GP, currently 1.55. Verstappen at 4.1 :shock:

I know Mercedes are expected to have an advantage but that seems a little bit of an overreaction. Unless something else is going on like Red Bull are planning to swap out the ICE?
greenmark
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Trader Pat wrote:
Fri Nov 26, 2021 10:00 pm
Hamilton priced very short for the Saudi GP, currently 1.55. Verstappen at 4.1 :shock:

I know Mercedes are expected to have an advantage but that seems a little bit of an overreaction. Unless something else is going on like Red Bull are planning to swap out the ICE?
Lol. Perhaps also the air-con, soundproofing and...... er.... driver, because software can drive a car better than a human. Oh yuk, why did I say that? What would be the point of sport without humans?
greenmark
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Frank Williams has left us.
He was quite a man.
Not easy to muscle in on the big teams.
9 constructors and 7 drivers titles.
RIP
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Derek27
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Location: UK

Ayton Senna once said he would drive for the Williams team for free. Somehow he ended up driving for them for a (reportedly) $20M salary!
greenmark
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Derek27 wrote:
Mon Nov 29, 2021 1:26 am
Ayton Senna once said he would drive for the Williams team for free. Somehow he ended up driving for them for a (reportedly) $20M salary!
Good memeory you've got there Derek. Without googling, my memory was he was properly miffed by the relative performance of Williams v McLaren. But that was Senna. Utter focus on winning. And that was Frank Williams too.
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Derek27
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greenmark wrote:
Mon Nov 29, 2021 7:16 pm
Derek27 wrote:
Mon Nov 29, 2021 1:26 am
Ayton Senna once said he would drive for the Williams team for free. Somehow he ended up driving for them for a (reportedly) $20M salary!
Good memeory you've got there Derek. Without googling, my memory was he was properly miffed by the relative performance of Williams v McLaren. But that was Senna. Utter focus on winning. And that was Frank Williams too.
I stopped following F1 when Shoemaker just started winning Grand Prixs so I can't really make comparisons but to me, Senna was like a god driving a car - absolute genius. Even when the Williams team with their active suspension was outperforming the McLarens he was still able to push them. The only trouble was, he thought he was god as well! It's funny how nobody has a problem with big-headed people when they actually live up to their ego. :lol:

Senna's relationship with Prost reminds me of my relationship with certain forum members. :lol:
Trader Pat
Posts: 4327
Joined: Tue Oct 25, 2016 12:50 pm

Derek27 wrote:
Mon Nov 29, 2021 8:38 pm
greenmark wrote:
Mon Nov 29, 2021 7:16 pm
Derek27 wrote:
Mon Nov 29, 2021 1:26 am
Ayton Senna once said he would drive for the Williams team for free. Somehow he ended up driving for them for a (reportedly) $20M salary!
Good memeory you've got there Derek. Without googling, my memory was he was properly miffed by the relative performance of Williams v McLaren. But that was Senna. Utter focus on winning. And that was Frank Williams too.
I stopped following F1 when Shoemaker just started winning Grand Prixs so I can't really make comparisons but to me, Senna was like a god driving a car - absolute genius. Even when the Williams team with their active suspension was outperforming the McLarens he was still able to push them. The only trouble was, he thought he was god as well! It's funny how nobody has a problem with big-headed people when they actually live up to their ego. :lol:

Senna's relationship with Prost reminds me of my relationship with certain forum members. :lol:
It was almost before my time but it was effectively a different sport back then. Imagine Hamilton and Verstappen in the same team today!

This season has been great but its definitely the exception. Most seasons F1 is barely worthy of being called a sport.
greenmark
Posts: 4948
Joined: Mon Jan 29, 2018 2:15 pm

Trader Pat wrote:
Mon Nov 29, 2021 8:56 pm
Derek27 wrote:
Mon Nov 29, 2021 8:38 pm
greenmark wrote:
Mon Nov 29, 2021 7:16 pm

Good memeory you've got there Derek. Without googling, my memory was he was properly miffed by the relative performance of Williams v McLaren. But that was Senna. Utter focus on winning. And that was Frank Williams too.
I stopped following F1 when Shoemaker just started winning Grand Prixs so I can't really make comparisons but to me, Senna was like a god driving a car - absolute genius. Even when the Williams team with their active suspension was outperforming the McLarens he was still able to push them. The only trouble was, he thought he was god as well! It's funny how nobody has a problem with big-headed people when they actually live up to their ego. :lol:

Senna's relationship with Prost reminds me of my relationship with certain forum members. :lol:
It was almost before my time but it was effectively a different sport back then. Imagine Hamilton and Verstappen in the same team today!

This season has been great but its definitely the exception. Most seasons F1 is barely worthy of being called a sport.
Williams was some guy. Totally owned up to the fact it was his fault he ended up in a wheelchair. But then ran an F1 team and was pretty damned successful. I'm not a fan of the concept of having "the right stuff", it's too easily used to mask bad behaviour, but in his situation and with his success you just have to applaud his achievements.
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Crazyskier
Posts: 1157
Joined: Sat Feb 06, 2016 6:36 pm

greenmark wrote:
Mon Nov 29, 2021 9:55 pm
Trader Pat wrote:
Mon Nov 29, 2021 8:56 pm
Derek27 wrote:
Mon Nov 29, 2021 8:38 pm

I stopped following F1 when Shoemaker just started winning Grand Prixs so I can't really make comparisons but to me, Senna was like a god driving a car - absolute genius. Even when the Williams team with their active suspension was outperforming the McLarens he was still able to push them. The only trouble was, he thought he was god as well! It's funny how nobody has a problem with big-headed people when they actually live up to their ego. :lol:

Senna's relationship with Prost reminds me of my relationship with certain forum members. :lol:
It was almost before my time but it was effectively a different sport back then. Imagine Hamilton and Verstappen in the same team today!

This season has been great but its definitely the exception. Most seasons F1 is barely worthy of being called a sport.
Williams was some guy. Totally owned up to the fact it was his fault he ended up in a wheelchair. But then ran an F1 team and was pretty damned successful. I'm not a fan of the concept of having "the right stuff", it's too easily used to mask bad behaviour, but in his situation and with his success you just have to applaud his achievements.
The only criticism I have was that he made Claire deputy TP instead of his son, who ended up managing the Williams museum.

Sir Frank and Sir Patrick Head were pioneers and it is my privilege to have watched their achievements, from the mid 80s.

CS
greenmark
Posts: 4948
Joined: Mon Jan 29, 2018 2:15 pm

Crazyskier wrote:
Fri Dec 03, 2021 3:55 pm
greenmark wrote:
Mon Nov 29, 2021 9:55 pm
Trader Pat wrote:
Mon Nov 29, 2021 8:56 pm


It was almost before my time but it was effectively a different sport back then. Imagine Hamilton and Verstappen in the same team today!

This season has been great but its definitely the exception. Most seasons F1 is barely worthy of being called a sport.
Williams was some guy. Totally owned up to the fact it was his fault he ended up in a wheelchair. But then ran an F1 team and was pretty damned successful. I'm not a fan of the concept of having "the right stuff", it's too easily used to mask bad behaviour, but in his situation and with his success you just have to applaud his achievements.
The only criticism I have was that he made Claire deputy TP instead of his son, who ended up managing the Williams museum.

Sir Frank and Sir Patrick Head were pioneers and it is my privilege to have watched their achievements, from the mid 80s.

CS
By all accounts his wife was a very strong individual. Perhaps he saw the same qualities in his daughter.
But, for me, one of the qualities i see in successful people is the ability to surround themselves with excellent folk. And Williams definitely had that ability.
greenmark
Posts: 4948
Joined: Mon Jan 29, 2018 2:15 pm

Wow. Max drops it! Where did that come from. Would never have predicted a driver mistake from Max. That's really interesting. I had Max in the box seat but under pressure in Saudi. But he just needed to play the percentages. Now he's gone over the limit and possibly screwed his whole year.
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