Gambling Commission Announcement & Government consultation

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jamesedwards
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The timing of this Gambling Commission announcement all seems very odd.

Announcement in April with full guidance to be issued in June and new rules live from September.

But how does this all fit in with the impending Government gambling white paper? https://igamingbusiness.com/uk-minister ... finalised/
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jamesedwards
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@Admin, perhaps today's posts should be split off into a new thread? This is an important development and is a bit lost in here.
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Euler
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I'll split into a new thread (Now done)
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jamesedwards
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Gambling Commission sets new rules on action for at risk customers
14 April 2022

NEW rules ensuring online gambling businesses do more to identify and take action to protect consumers at risk of harm have been introduced by the Gambling Commission.

The new rules, which come into effect on 12 September 2022, are stronger and more prescriptive, requiring operators to:

monitor a specific range of indicators1, as a minimum, to identify gambling harm
flag indicators of harm and take action in a timely manner
implement automated processes for strong indicators of harm
prevent marketing and the take-up of new bonuses for at risk customers
evaluate their interactions and ensure they interact with consumers at least at the level of problem gambling for the relevant activity
evidence their customer interaction evaluation to the Gambling Commission during routine casework
comply with these requirements at all times, this includes ensuring the compliance of third-party providers.
New guidance, which operators are required to take account of, will be issued in June to help them understand and comply with the requirements. We will engage with operators to enable the guidance to take account of queries we receive about the requirements following publication.

Gambling Commission Chief Executive, Andrew Rhodes, said: “Time and time again our enforcement cases show that some operators are still not doing enough to prevent gambling harm. These new rules, developed following an extensive consultation, make our expectations even more explicit.

“We expect operators to identify and tackle gambling harms with fast, proportionate and effective action and we will not hesitate to take tough action on operators who fail to do so.”

The strengthened requirements follow a consultation which was launched to address failings the Commission continued to see among online gambling operators. Although capable of identifying customers who may be harmed by gambling, operators were not always doing so or acting quickly enough. The Commission received approximately 13,000 responses to the consultation and call for evidence. All responses to the proposals were carefully considered to ensure proportionate, robust changes were made.

In the next phase of our programme of work to make online gambling fairer and safer, the Commission will proceed as planned and consult further on identifying customers who are financially vulnerable and tackling significant unaffordable gambling. Further updates will be provided when the consultation launches.

We will continue to work closely with DCMS and take account of the Government’s Gambling Act Review. Our broader programmes of work, focused on identifying customers at risk of harm will also continue, including close engagement with the BGC and ICO on the ‘single customer view’ pilot.


1 Licensees must use a range of indicators relevant to their customer and the nature of the gambling facilities provided in order to identify harm or potential harm associated with gambling. These must include:   

customer spend
patterns of spend
time spent gambling
gambling behaviour indicators
customer-led contact
use of gambling management tools
account indicators
tumby
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"time spent gambling" sounds ominous. My algos run 24 hours a day 7 days a week. Think i might get flagged!!!
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Derek27
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tumby wrote:
Fri Apr 15, 2022 7:52 pm
"time spent gambling" sounds ominous. My algos run 24 hours a day 7 days a week. Think i might get flagged!!!
I doubt they'll see it the way I do, but botting isn't time spent gambling. Even for manual trading, you're only actually gambling in the split second you place a bet - you're not gambling until you place your next bet. :)
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Dallas
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tumby wrote:
Fri Apr 15, 2022 7:52 pm
"time spent gambling" sounds ominous. My algos run 24 hours a day 7 days a week. Think i might get flagged!!!
My initial thought the first there was any mention of time spent gambling by BF a few months back was how they would deal with users who run automation?
Of course they could easily who is using automation and which bets are placed by bots etc so it wouldn't be to hard to exclude them when calculating time spent, but this BF we are talking about and it really wouldn't surprise me if they just done some sort of blanket restriction when the time comes - then once the penny drops for them they'll implement it properly to account for automation users.
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Derek27
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Dallas wrote:
Fri Apr 15, 2022 8:25 pm
tumby wrote:
Fri Apr 15, 2022 7:52 pm
"time spent gambling" sounds ominous. My algos run 24 hours a day 7 days a week. Think i might get flagged!!!
My initial thought the first there was any mention of time spent gambling by BF a few months back was how they would deal with users who run automation?
Of course they could easily who is using automation and which bets are placed by bots etc so it wouldn't be to hard to exclude them when calculating time spent, but this BF we are talking about and it really wouldn't surprise me if they just done some sort of blanket restriction when the time comes - then once the penny drops for them they'll implement it properly to account for automation users.
How can they tell between a bet place by clicking on the ladder and a bet fired by Guardian or Excel automation?
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Naffman
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Dallas wrote:
Fri Apr 15, 2022 8:25 pm
tumby wrote:
Fri Apr 15, 2022 7:52 pm
"time spent gambling" sounds ominous. My algos run 24 hours a day 7 days a week. Think i might get flagged!!!
My initial thought the first there was any mention of time spent gambling by BF a few months back was how they would deal with users who run automation?
Of course they could easily who is using automation and which bets are placed by bots etc so it wouldn't be to hard to exclude them when calculating time spent, but this BF we are talking about and it really wouldn't surprise me if they just done some sort of blanket restriction when the time comes - then once the penny drops for them they'll implement it properly to account for automation users.
If more than 10% of BF live chat personnel know what 'automation' is I'll be shocked.

If they go for the harshest restrictions then the markets will die overnight.
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ShaunWhite
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Derek27 wrote:
Fri Apr 15, 2022 8:29 pm
How can they tell between a bet place by clicking on the ladder and a bet fired by Guardian or Excel automation?
They can't but they can see who's using which api keys. Betfair spend a huge amount of time and effort supporting the professional automation side because it's them providing most of the liquidity. I doubt very much they'll abandon us easily and will argue the case for certain users to not be considered as 'normal' gamblers.

The way this is going though the only way to gamble professionally eventually may be to declare yourself to actually be a professional, removing the necessity for the service supplier to provide you with a duty of care. But of course that would require you to enter the tax system. It's slightly ridiculous though that people can 'trade' 247365 and then not declare a penny, or not be considered professional enough to manage their own affairs. I think I'd support a move to recognise that professional gambling isn't just the domain of bookies and casinos, if it meant I'd be treated as a 'professional'.
Last edited by ShaunWhite on Fri Apr 15, 2022 9:19 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Derek27
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Naffman wrote:
Fri Apr 15, 2022 8:30 pm
Dallas wrote:
Fri Apr 15, 2022 8:25 pm
tumby wrote:
Fri Apr 15, 2022 7:52 pm
"time spent gambling" sounds ominous. My algos run 24 hours a day 7 days a week. Think i might get flagged!!!
My initial thought the first there was any mention of time spent gambling by BF a few months back was how they would deal with users who run automation?
Of course they could easily who is using automation and which bets are placed by bots etc so it wouldn't be to hard to exclude them when calculating time spent, but this BF we are talking about and it really wouldn't surprise me if they just done some sort of blanket restriction when the time comes - then once the penny drops for them they'll implement it properly to account for automation users.
If more than 10% of BF live chat personnel know what 'automation' is I'll be shocked.

If they go for the harshest restrictions then the markets will die overnight.
If the Betfair live chat agents are given the task we're all completely buggered!
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ShaunWhite
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Derek27 wrote:
Fri Apr 15, 2022 9:18 pm
If the Betfair live chat agents are given the task we're all completely buggered!
The easiest thing to do is to just say "I'd like to raise a support request pls". Then cut/paste your well worded question, and they stick it in the system. Eventually you get a decent reply. It's a nice easy "call resolved" tick in the box for them so they don't often say you can't. The call handlers often aren't great but the actually support staff are usually really good.
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jamesedwards
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ShaunWhite wrote:
Fri Apr 15, 2022 9:18 pm

The way this is going though the only way to gamble professionally eventually may be to declare yourself to actually be a professional, removing the necessity for the service supplier to provide you with a duty of care. But of course that would require you to enter the tax system. It's slightly ridiculous though that people can 'trade' 247365 and then not declare a penny, or not be considered professional enough to manage their own affairs. I think I'd support a move to recognise that professional gambling isn't just the domain of bookies and casinos, if it meant I'd be treated as a 'professional'.
The trouble is 60% PC then 40% tax doesn't leave much cheese at the end of a hard day's trading.
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ShaunWhite
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jamesedwards wrote:
Fri Apr 15, 2022 10:00 pm
The trouble is 60% PC then 40% tax doesn't leave much cheese at the end of a hard day's trading.
You can avoid the 40% by earning 30 grand instead of 100 :)

If you were forced to go legit there's structures you can set up to reduce your costs. It's a million miles from what I'd want, but lots of small businesses see less than 40% of their takings after costs and before tax so it's doable, at a push, in theory, downhill with a tail wind. :?
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firlandsfarm
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Dallas wrote:
Fri Apr 15, 2022 8:25 pm
Of course they could easily who is using automation and which bets are placed by bots etc so it wouldn't be to hard to exclude them when calculating time spent ...
Hi Dallas ... can they distinguish a bet placed by BA from automation and one placed manually from the Ladder? Would they not just see both bets as being from overlay software such as BA?
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