boris and rishi partygate fines

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firlandsfarm
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Derek27 wrote:
Mon May 23, 2022 6:13 pm
firlandsfarm will be back soon claiming that he wasn't lying. ;)
It's a real shame that you do not understand the definition of a lie ... I give up trying to educate you.
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firlandsfarm
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Derek27 wrote:
Sun May 22, 2022 9:35 am
When will you realise it's entirely irrelevant how much notice you've had for a gathering? It's simply a question of whether you've broken the rules!
And when will you realise that Capt. Hindsight (probably) broke the rules? And probably many others around the country. Criticism of one should mean the criticism of all transgressors for not to do so might mean a political motive.
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Derek27
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firlandsfarm wrote:
Tue May 24, 2022 9:04 am
Derek27 wrote:
Sun May 22, 2022 8:53 am
BJ said that no rules were broken. He didn't say "I don't think", "I was advised", "as far as I'm aware" or "to the best of my knowledge", he stated categorically that no rules were broken.
I suggest you check Hansard where you will find he told the House that he had "repeatedly" been advised no rules were broken. When are you going to realise that on that basis and in accordance with the English language he did not lie.
Just look at the first few clips. :)

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/ ... ovid-rules

When are you going to realise that hitmen don't get away with murder because they were advised it is legal? We're expected to take responsibility for our own actions but the PM's advisors are expected to be responsible for him, like a six-year-old child!
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Derek27
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firlandsfarm wrote:
Tue May 24, 2022 9:26 am
Derek27 wrote:
Sun May 22, 2022 8:53 am
If somebody claiming means-tested benefits receives a substantial sum of money in a will and fails to inform the DWP, continues to claim benefit for several years and subsequentially faces criminal charges of fraud, the court will apply the law. The law doesn't simply care about whether he lied (he will have signed a declaration to inform about a change in circumstances) or knowingly mislead. The legal test is whether he can be reasonably expected to know that he was obliged to inform the DWP of his windfall. I'm sure you'll agree that that's a much fairer test than trying to prove what somebody did or didn't know, as mind-reading is still to this day science fiction.
Well you seem to be confusing breaking the law with telling a lie. I'm sure you will agree that if the law is broken then it is broken but that you broke the law does not mean you lied. I have never said he didn't break the law but you have always said he lied which according to authorities of the English language he clearly did not. Maybe you been on a crash course for mind-reading? I thought it was still science fiction!
You need to be a mind reader to be 100% certain that somebody's lying, but that's not where the bar's set. The First-tier Tribunal will decide not to believe an appellant if his evidence is either self-contradictory or inherently improbable, and that's the threshold I use to detect a lying git.

BJ claimed there was no party on 13/11/20 and "that all rules were followed whatever happened". How could he know that all rules were followed if he didn't know what happened?

How could he not know what happened when he was present, pouring the drinks and raising a toast?

Then he claimed he didn't know it was a party. If you believe that firlandsfarm, you're either nieve or believe what you want to.
firlandsfarm wrote:
Tue May 24, 2022 9:26 am
Derek27 wrote:
Sun May 22, 2022 8:53 am
No. 10, the place that houses the idiot who's actually running this country and set covid laws has accumulated more covid fines than any other organisation in the country. You're the one that doesn't get it!
As someone who I would expect to have a reasonable understanding of statistics I'm surprised that you should make such a claim. Yes it is factually correct but if only one group has been investigated in such depth it is hardly surprising that they have more than any other organisation (that hasn't been investigated)!
The police can't investigate organisations at random. Allegations have to be made. There weren't many allegations against other organisations because most people were following the rules!
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Derek27
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firlandsfarm wrote:
Tue May 24, 2022 9:28 am
Derek27 wrote:
Mon May 23, 2022 6:13 pm
firlandsfarm will be back soon claiming that he wasn't lying. ;)
It's a real shame that you do not understand the definition of a lie ... I give up trying to educate you.
It's a real shame you don't understand level of proof. If you were a member of a jury you'd find every defendant not guilty on the grounds that you're not a mind reader!
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Derek27
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firlandsfarm wrote:
Tue May 24, 2022 9:35 am
Derek27 wrote:
Sun May 22, 2022 9:35 am
When will you realise it's entirely irrelevant how much notice you've had for a gathering? It's simply a question of whether you've broken the rules!
And when will you realise that Capt. Hindsight (probably) broke the rules? And probably many others around the country. Criticism of one should mean the criticism of all transgressors for not to do so might mean a political motive.
Probably? :lol: :lol: :lol:

There's no comparison between the two allegations and the sheer number of allegations against BJ. Having a meal at work was not breaking any rules.
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alexmr2
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firlandsfarm wrote:
Tue May 24, 2022 9:28 am
Derek27 wrote:
Mon May 23, 2022 6:13 pm
firlandsfarm will be back soon claiming that he wasn't lying. ;)
It's a real shame that you do not understand the definition of a lie ... I give up trying to educate you.
I just worked it out that Derek is the agent Smith of Betangel forum

You can say any rational thing like "the earth is flat" or "5G is killing the pigeons" and he will appear and debunk it before anyone can swallow the red pill and wake up

Derek with his 15k forum posts is the guardian of the matrix and he is programmed to stop the truths that threaten it
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Derek27
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firlandsfarm wrote:
Tue May 24, 2022 9:35 am
Derek27 wrote:
Sun May 22, 2022 9:35 am
When will you realise it's entirely irrelevant how much notice you've had for a gathering? It's simply a question of whether you've broken the rules!
And when will you realise that Capt. Hindsight (probably) broke the rules? And probably many others around the country. Criticism of one should mean the criticism of all transgressors for not to do so might mean a political motive.
Just compare the image of BJ holding his glass well above his head to toast the party to the video of Starmer casually drinking beer with a woman in the background eating her curry and talking to a guy who presumably finished his. No sign of any party atmosphere. :D
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alexmr2
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Derek27 wrote:
Tue May 24, 2022 2:12 pm
firlandsfarm wrote:
Tue May 24, 2022 9:35 am
Derek27 wrote:
Sun May 22, 2022 9:35 am
When will you realise it's entirely irrelevant how much notice you've had for a gathering? It's simply a question of whether you've broken the rules!
And when will you realise that Capt. Hindsight (probably) broke the rules? And probably many others around the country. Criticism of one should mean the criticism of all transgressors for not to do so might mean a political motive.
Just compare the image of BJ holding his glass well above his head to toast the party to the video of Starmer casually drinking beer with a woman in the background eating her curry and talking to a guy who presumably finished his. No sign of any party atmosphere. :D
The semantics of partygate are just a distraction from Bill Gates' new monkey virus. There's going to be a lot of monkeys running around when the 5G gets switched on put it that way
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Derek27
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alexmr2 wrote:
Tue May 24, 2022 5:25 pm
Derek27 wrote:
Tue May 24, 2022 2:12 pm
firlandsfarm wrote:
Tue May 24, 2022 9:35 am

And when will you realise that Capt. Hindsight (probably) broke the rules? And probably many others around the country. Criticism of one should mean the criticism of all transgressors for not to do so might mean a political motive.
Just compare the image of BJ holding his glass well above his head to toast the party to the video of Starmer casually drinking beer with a woman in the background eating her curry and talking to a guy who presumably finished his. No sign of any party atmosphere. :D
The semantics of partygate are just a distraction from Bill Gates' new monkey virus. There's going to be a lot of monkeys running around when the 5G gets switched on put it that way
You could have said that horse racing is a distraction from Bill Gates' new monkey virus and put that stupid comment on the Today's Racing thread!
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Derek27
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More eye-witness reports of routine parties at No. 10. Rooms filled shoulder to shoulder, staff sitting on each other's laps, bins overflowing with empty bottles, and security guards laughed at when they tried to stop it. :D

BJ says he takes the allegations very seriously. :lol: :lol:
Archery1969
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Derek27 wrote:
Tue May 24, 2022 6:08 pm
More eye-witness reports of routine parties at No. 10. Rooms filled shoulder to shoulder, staff sitting on each other's laps, bins overflowing with empty bottles, and security guards laughed at when they tried to stop it. :D

BJ says he takes the allegations very seriously. :lol: :lol:
There are some rumours going around that Police officers also attended the shin digs, hence why the Met is not investigating everything or issuing any more fines. Unless ofcourse they going to issue their own offficers with fixed penalty notices. :)
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Derek27
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Archery1969 wrote:
Tue May 24, 2022 7:25 pm
Derek27 wrote:
Tue May 24, 2022 6:08 pm
More eye-witness reports of routine parties at No. 10. Rooms filled shoulder to shoulder, staff sitting on each other's laps, bins overflowing with empty bottles, and security guards laughed at when they tried to stop it. :D

BJ says he takes the allegations very seriously. :lol: :lol:
There are some rumours going around that Police officers also attended the shin digs, hence why the Met is not investigating everything or issuing any more fines. Unless ofcourse they going to issue their own offficers with fixed penalty notices. :)
Wouldn't surprise me, after all, they join in with the pitch invasions. :)
Emmson
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Blighty is becoming a very corrupt country, you who voted for this government can own it and I don't want to hear any whataboutery about what a disaster Jezza would've been, I never voted for him either.
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Derek27
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firlandsfarm wrote:
Tue May 24, 2022 9:26 am
I have never said he didn't break the law but you have always said he lied which according to authorities of the English language he clearly did not.
:lol: :lol: :lol: I think you need to rephrase that. The English dictionary is not a lie detector.

I think I'll educate you about the word lie. If I told you who won last year's Derby, I could be lying, telling the truth or mistaken.

But, if I told you who's going to win this year's Derby it goes without saying I'm giving an opinion or tip.

Likewise, when you call somebody a liar you are expressing an opinion. Sometimes a claim is so inconceivable you can say with near certainty that it's false and known to be false by the claimer. Take Ian Huntley, the Soham murderer for example. His claim was that one of the girls had a nosebleed, went up to the bathroom, fell into a bath full of water and drowned, the other girl started screaming so he put his hand over her mouth and accidentally suffocated her. That could have happened, only he knows for certain, but you don't need to be a mind reader to say that's all bullshit. Are you seriously telling me I can't call him a liar?

Normally when somebody tells a lie they are the only person in the world who knows with absolute certainty that they are lying. But there are some people who are so deluded they don't even know themselves. Honest people think before answering questions. Pathological liars, when asked questions where the answer could potentially have negative consequences, can have a mental block on any answer with a negative outcome. It's as though those options don't exist.

BJ was asked if a party took place on 13/11/2020. He said no. He then went further and said, "no rules were broken". It's a matter of fact that he didn't know whether any rules were broken, just as you and I don't know if we broke any rules on 13/11/2020. He didn't even need to say that as he wasn't asked if rules were broken.

If you asked me what I was doing on that date, I would simply say I don't know but I was probably at home on my own, trading, drinking or doing both. BJ's not even capable of thinking of what he was doing, his instinct is to deny anything he's accused of, just like the child with a face full of chocolate denying eating the chocolate cake.
Last edited by Derek27 on Wed May 25, 2022 12:32 am, edited 1 time in total.
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