RANT CORNER

[ShaunWhite]

What is the US scared off? A Chinese spy balloon observing their missile defence systems and they're too scared to shoot it down!!

President Biden takes advice from the BA forum and shot it down.

Thought it was quite funny seeing an American General saying he was concerned when it stopped over an air base. One look at the windsock might have given him a clue about why that happened.

[jamesedwards]

There's so much outrage over utility companies breaking into the homes of vulnerable people, particularly the mistaken victim who wasn't even in debt, but what about the magistrates that sign the warrants? What accountability do they get held to?

I think the problem is that there isn't a warrent. There won't be much outrage because it's the poor. If it was the middle classes then they'd be kicking off.

From what I've gathered from the news, the arseholes that carry out these break-ins have warrants. I think it's unlikely they'd do it without one. The magistrates have been handing out warrants willy-nilly. What I was getting at is that judges make mistakes, errors of law that can be corrected in a higher court, but what accountability is there for judges that make gross, deliberate errors or completely neglect to look at the evidence?

The other side of this story though, what are you supposed to do if your customer refuses to pay any bills and refuses any entry? You just have to supply them for free forever? You can't legally cut them off and now you can't legally force a change to a prepay meter. Of course, the ones we hear about in the media are the errors and the vulnerable where it shouldn't have happened, but for all we know they may be a small exception.

[Derek27]

I think the problem is that there isn't a warrent. There won't be much outrage because it's the poor. If it was the middle classes then they'd be kicking off.

From what I've gathered from the news, the arseholes that carry out these break-ins have warrants. I think it's unlikely they'd do it without one. The magistrates have been handing out warrants willy-nilly. What I was getting at is that judges make mistakes, errors of law that can be corrected in a higher court, but what accountability is there for judges that make gross, deliberate errors or completely neglect to look at the evidence?

The other side of this story though, what are you supposed to do if your customer refuses to pay any bills and refuses any entry? You just have to supply them for free forever? You can't legally cut them off and now you can't legally force a change to a prepay meter. Of course, the ones we hear about in the media are the errors and the vulnerable where it shouldn't have happened, but for all we know they may be a small exception.

People who can afford to pay but don't are irrelevant. They deserve to be cut off or put on a prepay meter and so it's not newsworthy. It's a bit like police brutality in the US. It's just a small minority that needlessly gets beaten to death.

About 5 years ago, I had a neighbour with health problems including recovering from cancer who had her outside gas meter replaced with a prepayment meter when she was ill and staying with her parents. They probably didn't need a warrant as they didn't enter her flat, but they had no legal right to do it. It's a widespread problem.

[jamesedwards]

From what I've gathered from the news, the arseholes that carry out these break-ins have warrants. I think it's unlikely they'd do it without one. The magistrates have been handing out warrants willy-nilly. What I was getting at is that judges make mistakes, errors of law that can be corrected in a higher court, but what accountability is there for judges that make gross, deliberate errors or completely neglect to look at the evidence?

The other side of this story though, what are you supposed to do if your customer refuses to pay any bills and refuses any entry? You just have to supply them for free forever? You can't legally cut them off and now you can't legally force a change to a prepay meter. Of course, the ones we hear about in the media are the errors and the vulnerable where it shouldn't have happened, but for all we know they may be a small exception.

People who can afford to pay but don't are irrelevant. They deserve to be cut off or put on a prepay meter and so it's not newsworthy. It's a bit like police brutality in the US. It's just a small minority that needlessly gets beaten to death.

About 5 years ago, I had a neighbour with health problems including recovering from cancer who had her outside gas meter replaced with a prepayment meter when she was ill and staying with her parents. They probably didn't need a warrant as they didn't enter her flat, but they had no legal right to do it. It's a widespread problem.

I don't know the details, but presumably they're only been 'breaking in' when they've been repeatably denied access to their meter. Whatever you believe about the morals of these companies, there's no way they would be spending £££s sending in bailiffs and locksmiths unless they had exhausted other avenues first.

[Derek27]

The other side of this story though, what are you supposed to do if your customer refuses to pay any bills and refuses any entry? You just have to supply them for free forever? You can't legally cut them off and now you can't legally force a change to a prepay meter. Of course, the ones we hear about in the media are the errors and the vulnerable where it shouldn't have happened, but for all we know they may be a small exception.

People who can afford to pay but don't are irrelevant. They deserve to be cut off or put on a prepay meter and so it's not newsworthy. It's a bit like police brutality in the US. It's just a small minority that needlessly gets beaten to death.

About 5 years ago, I had a neighbour with health problems including recovering from cancer who had her outside gas meter replaced with a prepayment meter when she was ill and staying with her parents. They probably didn't need a warrant as they didn't enter her flat, but they had no legal right to do it. It's a widespread problem.

I don't know the details, but presumably they're only been 'breaking in' when they've been repeatably denied access to their meter. Whatever you believe about the morals of these companies, there's no way they would be spending £££s sending in bailiffs and locksmiths unless they had exhausted other avenues first.

How much exactly is £££s? Have you calculated how long it would take to recover the money on prepay meter rates? If somebody already owes the cost and other expences of replacing the meter they've made the money back already.

You might think there's no way anyone would have £1000 on a horse at 1.01 because it looks like winning or there's no way a Tory would want to slash taxes after losing the nation £50,000,000,000 when they tried it a few months ago, but you'd be wrong.

[jamesedwards]

People who can afford to pay but don't are irrelevant. They deserve to be cut off or put on a prepay meter and so it's not newsworthy. It's a bit like police brutality in the US. It's just a small minority that needlessly gets beaten to death.

About 5 years ago, I had a neighbour with health problems including recovering from cancer who had her outside gas meter replaced with a prepayment meter when she was ill and staying with her parents. They probably didn't need a warrant as they didn't enter her flat, but they had no legal right to do it. It's a widespread problem.

I don't know the details, but presumably they're only been 'breaking in' when they've been repeatably denied access to their meter. Whatever you believe about the morals of these companies, there's no way they would be spending £££s sending in bailiffs and locksmiths unless they had exhausted other avenues first.

How much exactly is £££s? Have you calculated how long it would take to recover the money on prepay meter rates? If somebody already owes the cost and other expences of replacing the meter they've made the money back already.

You might think there's no way anyone would have £1000 on a horse at 1.01 because it looks like winning or there's no way a Tory would want to slash taxes after losing the nation £50,000,000,000 when they tried it a few months ago, but you'd be wrong.

I imagine the cost of sending a bailiff, locksmith and installer, is significantly more than the cost of a simple installation. Therefore logic says they would only have been doing it as a matter of last resort once all other avenues had been explored. I'm just saying the media will spin any story to fit their narrative, which at the moment is very much cost of living crisis and greedy power companies. They must be loving that they were able to tick two boxes with one story!

[Derek27]

I don't know the details, but presumably they're only been 'breaking in' when they've been repeatably denied access to their meter. Whatever you believe about the morals of these companies, there's no way they would be spending £££s sending in bailiffs and locksmiths unless they had exhausted other avenues first.

How much exactly is £££s? Have you calculated how long it would take to recover the money on prepay meter rates? If somebody already owes the cost and other expences of replacing the meter they've made the money back already.

You might think there's no way anyone would have £1000 on a horse at 1.01 because it looks like winning or there's no way a Tory would want to slash taxes after losing the nation £50,000,000,000 when they tried it a few months ago, but you'd be wrong.

I imagine the cost of sending a bailiff, locksmith and installer, is significantly more than the cost of a simple installation. Therefore logic says they would only have been doing it as a matter of last resort once all other avenues had been explored. I'm just saying the media will spin any story to fit their narrative, which at the moment is very much cost of living crisis and greedy power companies. They must be loving that they were able to tick two boxes with one story!

What you would imagine and what (in your opinion) logic says is entirely irrelevant. It is a matter of fact that vulnerable people are having their homes broken into and the law is allowing it. We're talking about thousands of cases, not just one or two. It is also a fact that people die in their homes in wintertime without power and gas. I'm not just talking about sick or elderly people. Just imagine if you had the flu and were living in freezing temperatures.

If I murdered somebody and got arrested by the police, the law requires that I'm provided with food and heating until the court hearing, and after if I'm found guilty. If somebody doesn't pay their gas bill, should a court decide whether they're able to pay, or should some idiot working for the energy company be able to sentence them to death?

[Derek27]

When I was 4 years old, all the books I read were mainly pictures. It only took a few years to learn to read sufficiently enough to do without the pictures. Today, I log into Spotify and search for Beyonce's albums. I don't know what album I'm looking for but I'd recognise the title if it just displayed a flipping list of her albums. But no, they treat me like a flipping 4-year-old and all I get is an endless page of thumbnails.

[jamesedwards]

How much exactly is £££s? Have you calculated how long it would take to recover the money on prepay meter rates? If somebody already owes the cost and other expences of replacing the meter they've made the money back already.

You might think there's no way anyone would have £1000 on a horse at 1.01 because it looks like winning or there's no way a Tory would want to slash taxes after losing the nation £50,000,000,000 when they tried it a few months ago, but you'd be wrong.

I imagine the cost of sending a bailiff, locksmith and installer, is significantly more than the cost of a simple installation. Therefore logic says they would only have been doing it as a matter of last resort once all other avenues had been explored. I'm just saying the media will spin any story to fit their narrative, which at the moment is very much cost of living crisis and greedy power companies. They must be loving that they were able to tick two boxes with one story!

What you would imagine and what (in your opinion) logic says is entirely irrelevant. It is a matter of fact that vulnerable people are having their homes broken into and the law is allowing it.

Or just let them have access to their meter so they don't have to break in? Just a thought...

[Derek27]

I imagine the cost of sending a bailiff, locksmith and installer, is significantly more than the cost of a simple installation. Therefore logic says they would only have been doing it as a matter of last resort once all other avenues had been explored. I'm just saying the media will spin any story to fit their narrative, which at the moment is very much cost of living crisis and greedy power companies. They must be loving that they were able to tick two boxes with one story!

What you would imagine and what (in your opinion) logic says is entirely irrelevant. It is a matter of fact that vulnerable people are having their homes broken into and the law is allowing it.

Or just let them have access to their meter so they don't have to break in? Just a thought...

Yes, and let them have access to your car so they don't have to break into your garage.

You realise everybody who has a meter in the cupboard under the stairs, even the ones like you and me who regularly pay our bills on time, would need to have our meters moved outside so they can replace it if we don't pay. Who pays the cost?

[jimibt]

What you would imagine and what (in your opinion) logic says is entirely irrelevant. It is a matter of fact that vulnerable people are having their homes broken into and the law is allowing it.

Or just let them have access to their meter so they don't have to break in? Just a thought...

Yes, and let them have access to your car so they don't have to break into your garage.

You realise everybody who has a meter in the cupboard under the stairs, even the ones like you and me who regularly pay our bills on time, would need to have our meters moved outside so they can replace it if we don't pay. Who pays the cost?

we have GDPR in EU law to support online privacy, yet, actions like this can be taken by *agents* against the interests and will of the home dwellers...

a lot to be said about the spirit and wisdom of the formative years of the NHS and the thinking behind it in terms of the ordinary family ...

[jamesedwards]

Or just let them have access to their meter so they don't have to break in? Just a thought...

Yes, and let them have access to your car so they don't have to break into your garage.

You realise everybody who has a meter in the cupboard under the stairs, even the ones like you and me who regularly pay our bills on time, would need to have our meters moved outside so they can replace it if we don't pay. Who pays the cost?

we have GDPR in EU law to support online privacy, yet, actions like this can be taken by *agents* against the interests and will of the home dwellers...

a lot to be said about the spirit and wisdom of the formative years of the NHS and the thinking behind it in terms of the ordinary family ...

Playing devil's advocate here... What do you propose as a solution where a customer refuses to pay and refuses entry to change the meter to pre-paid?

[Derek27]

Yes, and let them have access to your car so they don't have to break into your garage.

You realise everybody who has a meter in the cupboard under the stairs, even the ones like you and me who regularly pay our bills on time, would need to have our meters moved outside so they can replace it if we don't pay. Who pays the cost?

we have GDPR in EU law to support online privacy, yet, actions like this can be taken by *agents* against the interests and will of the home dwellers...

a lot to be said about the spirit and wisdom of the formative years of the NHS and the thinking behind it in terms of the ordinary family ...

Playing devil's advocate here... What do you propose as a solution where a customer refuses to pay and refuses entry to change the meter to pre-paid?

I know you're asking Jim, but as it's half time I'll give you the answer. Same as any other legal claim, take them to court and allow them to appear and defend themselves. At least the woman who wasn't even in debt would be protected, as would others in genuine difficulty.

It's easy to forget that utility companies were once government owned and run by trusted people. Now, empowering them to bypass courts is like allowing private landlords the power to kick tenants out and seize their goods for rent they claim is owed!

[jamesedwards]

we have GDPR in EU law to support online privacy, yet, actions like this can be taken by *agents* against the interests and will of the home dwellers...

a lot to be said about the spirit and wisdom of the formative years of the NHS and the thinking behind it in terms of the ordinary family ...

Playing devil's advocate here... What do you propose as a solution where a customer refuses to pay and refuses entry to change the meter to pre-paid?

I know you're asking Jim, but as it's half time I'll give you the answer. Same as any other legal claim, take them to court and allow them to appear and defend themselves. At least the woman who wasn't even in debt would be protected, as would others in genuine difficulty.

Cue floods of people abusing a long and costly court process, when they could just open their front door?

[Derek27]

Playing devil's advocate here... What do you propose as a solution where a customer refuses to pay and refuses entry to change the meter to pre-paid?

I know you're asking Jim, but as it's half time I'll give you the answer. Same as any other legal claim, take them to court and allow them to appear and defend themselves. At least the woman who wasn't even in debt would be protected, as would others in genuine difficulty.

Cue floods of people abusing a long and costly court process, when they could just open their front door?

Just wait until Betfair claim you own them a grand. It would be a costly court process but I trust you'll just open your chequebook.

Better still, scrap the County Court and give people the legal right to break into any home where they believe the householder owes them money.