Anyone had to 'proof' their Betfair income to a financial institution?

[jimibt]

You need to scatter some forward thinking real life scenarios into the mix and without being a prophet of doom it could be something like this.

1.In 10yrs time time you have a stroke and are unable to trade any more. Luckily you have a BTL property that will provide you with enough income for the future to pay for your healthcare. (Firlands is an expert on this)

2. You gift to your offspring and all goes well. You have a stroke, have to sell up and downsize as not enough £ to fund healthcare. Offspring want to put you in a care home but not pay to help.

3. You gift to your offspring. They get in with a bad bunch and marry a waster who you hate and they hate you more. Unforseen tragedy and waster rolls off into sunset giving you the finger with your hard earnt never to be seen again.

my god Mr Dickens, what a bleak trip it is to olde London town on this day, or as you would have said: “The universe makes rather an indifferent parent, I'm afraid.”

[spreadbetting]

Thanks, firlsands, certainly don't want to become their landlord along with all the CGT ,and dreaded HMRC, etc plus they wouldn't want me being their landlord either

At the end of the day they'll just be getting some of their inheritance a bit earlier to get a leg on the ladder. If they spunk it , so be it. I'd rather it was spent on a house than my healthcare, gambling for a living we're assessing probabilities every day so on balance I'd be happy with the choice i made and if it goes tits up it wouldn't be the first bet to go astray.

From bits I've been reading it really shouldn't be a problem and little more than a letter to confirm the money is a non returnable gift etc and maybe letter from BF/Bank to confirm funds have come from Betfair and not some crack house.

[Derek27]

You need to scatter some forward thinking real life scenarios into the mix and without being a prophet of doom [ ] it could be something like this.

1.In 10yrs time time you have a stroke and are unable to trade any more. Luckily you have a BTL property that will provide you with enough income for the future to pay for your healthcare. (Firlands is an expert on this)

2. You gift to your offspring and all goes well. You have a stroke, have to sell up and downsize as not enough £ to fund healthcare. Offspring want to put you in a care home but not pay to help.

3. You gift to your offspring. They get in with a bad bunch and marry a waster who you hate and they hate you more. Unforseen tragedy and waster rolls off into sunset giving you the finger with your hard earnt never to be seen again.

You left out scenario 4, the old murder for access to inheritance.

[Jukebox]

You left out scenario 4, the old murder for access to inheritance.

Carry on seeing your mates without social distancing attend a few illegal raves and make sure you kiss your parents and grandma at every opportunity.

[Atho55]

The seed has been sown....

[BeastofBrine]

Spreadbetting, if you're just gifting them the money, it's very unlikely that a bank will want to do any checks on you.

I was a mortgage broker/financial adviser until last year and never had any problems arise with the gifting process in respect of this issue (though I expect that rules will tighten further in the future).

[spreadbetting]

Spreadbetting, if you're just gifting them the money, it's very unlikely that a bank will want to do any checks on you.

I was a mortgage broker/financial adviser until last year and never had any problems arise with the gifting process in respect of this issue (though I expect that rules will tighten further in the future).

Thanks, think I was overthinking it a bit, guess earning a living in the grey economy you always want to keep your head under the radar.

[LinusP]

Thanks, firlsands, certainly don't want to become their landlord along with all the CGT ,and dreaded HMRC, etc plus they wouldn't want me being their landlord either

At the end of the day they'll just be getting some of their inheritance a bit earlier to get a leg on the ladder. If they spunk it , so be it. I'd rather it was spent on a house than my healthcare, gambling for a living we're assessing probabilities every day so on balance I'd be happy with the choice i made and if it goes tits up it wouldn't be the first bet to go astray.

From bits I've been reading it really shouldn't be a problem and little more than a letter to confirm the money is a non returnable gift etc and maybe letter from BF/Bank to confirm funds have come from Betfair and not some crack house.

As mentioned strongly recommend not mentioning betfair, layer it through something else like an investment account and say it’s savings, in the current market they may just say no if you mention betfair.

[BFDon]

I bought a house 2 years ago. I'd been full time on BF for 10 years with no 'income'. My share of the purchase was to come from savings amassed from BF winnings and my partner's mostly from a mortgage. The first broker we spoke to wanted to be clever and provide as little detail as possible about my 'job' and where the money for the deposit had come from. That seemed optimistic given I had numerous 4 figure transactions on my statements which I needed to send to them and one of the questions from the solicitor is to provide details of the source of the deposit. On top of that because I had no 'income' I was seen as a dependent so it reduced the amount my partner could borrow.

The next broker couldn't have been better, we were open about everything, I provided P+L statements and she secured a mortgage (based on my partner's income) with a highstreet lender at no higher rate. I think she also managed to use the dividends which I was getting from savings to boost the amount we could borrow. Had I approached them directly it probably would have been a different story.

But I have been consistently profitable on BF so all the transactions on my statements were money coming in and with the large deposit the LTV was small so low risk to the bank.

Some banks might take issue with a gift from gambling winnings (could argue you might want it back when you start losing) but there's plenty out there that wont. I'd speak to a broker anyway, they were worth every penny to us (pm if you want the online firm we used)

[firlandsfarm]

From bits I've been reading it really shouldn't be a problem and little more than a letter to confirm the money is a non returnable gift etc and maybe letter from BF/Bank to confirm funds have come from Betfair and not some crack house.

You certainly should have a letter confirming it is a gift (remember that it may need to be disclosed to HMRC as a gift in lifetime (gift inter vivos) depending on amount).

As mentioned strongly recommend not mentioning betfair, layer it through something else like an investment account and say it’s savings, in the current market they may just say no if you mention betfair.

And while I see the need to be open and frank about it I agree with LinusP I wouldn't volunteer it … half those working for solicitors/banks don't understand the difference between betting and gambling and still think it's a mugs game and the other half will see you as a money launderer for sure! I applied for a BTL mortgage years ago and they wanted to see copies of my last 3 months bank statements and despite the payments to/from bookies and Betfair showed a cash flow profit they turned me down because I was "clearly addicted to gambling"!

[jimibt]

From bits I've been reading it really shouldn't be a problem and little more than a letter to confirm the money is a non returnable gift etc and maybe letter from BF/Bank to confirm funds have come from Betfair and not some crack house.

You certainly should have a letter confirming it is a gift (remember that it may need to be disclosed to HMRC as a gift in lifetime (gift inter vivos) depending on amount).

As mentioned strongly recommend not mentioning betfair, layer it through something else like an investment account and say it’s savings, in the current market they may just say no if you mention betfair.

And while I see the need to be open and frank about it I agree with LinusP I wouldn't volunteer it … half those working for solicitors/banks don't understand the difference between betting and gambling and still think it's a mugs game and the other half will see you as a money launderer for sure! I applied for a BTL mortgage years ago and they wanted to see copies of my last 3 months bank statements and despite the payments to/from bookies and Betfair showed a cash flow profit they turned me down because I was "clearly addicted to gambling"!

why don't you (or didn't you) keep two bank accounts - definitely you don't want to be mixing your betfair inputs/outputs in an account that may need to prove income/expenditure..

[firlandsfarm]

why don't you (or didn't you) keep two bank accounts - definitely you don't want to be mixing your betfair inputs/outputs in an account that may need to prove income/expenditure..

I was betting before I started BTL'ing! Never expected to need another mortgage and in any event never expected to have to produce bank statements. Previous mortgages were on a self certification basis so I was caught with my proverbials down!

[Grinderman]

I have 2 current accounts with the same bank. Both with big overdraft facilities from when I used to have a well paid 'propper' job. What I have done for years is overdraw about £15k on a Saturday or for big meetings to boost my Betfair bank. Then withdraw it from Betfair straight back in when I had done. As you can imagine, the bank statements look horrendous.

I have a current account with a building society. I keep this as my 'clean' account. Whenever I need to get any kind of credit, this is the one that I show. They don't like to see any kind of gambling transactions - even a little online bingo habit.

About 4 years ago, the bank called me in for an 'account appraisal'. That's it I thought, in trouble now. So I printed out the XL spreadsheets that I maintain for my P&L - 10 years worth, and went in for my appointment. I explained that I had been doing this for years and the only thing keeping my account in credit was my Betfair proceeds. Well, her jaw dropped, she couldn't believe it. I was sat in that little room telling my tale for about an hour.

Afterwards, she shook my hand and told me that it was the most entertaining account appraisal she had ever done. "I can't wait to tell my colleagues" she said.

I went home and waited for the fallout. To this day, I never heard anything back from it and I still have my overdrafts.

[TheRiddler]

Buy the property for them . They then pay you per month under contract. That's what I did with my seven.

I'd still have to proof the money to buy the property though and much rather they had some financial responsiblities for their own long term credit history etc.

Bit late to post this (not a frequent user/reader of forums). Should have made clear that my transactions all completed outside of UK as I'm not a national. I will not add as more than likely you will have reached a solution by now. Good luck - TR.