Automotion in running for a horse to place not win

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01wayne
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Is there a Automotion bot in-running for a backing horse to place not win?
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Dallas
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A rules file can be applied to any type of market, so if you are looking for something to back a runner/s to place all you'd need to begin with is a regular 'Place Back bet' rule
01wayne
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Dallas wrote:
Tue Oct 20, 2020 10:12 pm
A rules file can be applied to any type of market, so if you are looking for something to back a runner/s to place all you'd need to begin with is a regular 'Place Back bet' rule
Thanks for replying. I need a bit more help please Dallas. I'm a newbie for this and need some hand holding as I don't know where to start with this
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Dallas
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01wayne wrote:
Wed Oct 21, 2020 4:39 pm
Dallas wrote:
Tue Oct 20, 2020 10:12 pm
A rules file can be applied to any type of market, so if you are looking for something to back a runner/s to place all you'd need to begin with is a regular 'Place Back bet' rule
Thanks for replying. I need a bit more help please Dallas. I'm a newbie for this and need some hand holding as I don't know where to start with this
This blog will guide you through the process of creating a rules file
https://www.betfairtradingblog.com/betf ... tion-easy/

But I've attached a rule here you can download and import which will back the fav 1min before the off for £2
You can edit it anyway you want from there
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.
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ANGELS15
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Hi just a quick question on the subject of Betfair place terms:

Am I correct in understanding if you back a horse for a place on Betfair, let's say an 8 runner race with 3 places. If there was a withdrawal and you now have 7 runners you still get paid out on the 3rd place horse (albeit with a reduction)?

Surprisingly despite being a Betfair user for 20 years I very rarely look at or use the place market.
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jimibt
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ANGELS15 wrote:
Thu Oct 22, 2020 10:47 am
Hi just a quick question on the subject of Betfair place terms:

Am I correct in understanding if you back a horse for a place on Betfair, let's say an 8 runner race with 3 places. If there was a withdrawal and you now have 7 runners you still get paid out on the 3rd place horse (albeit with a reduction)?

Surprisingly despite being a Betfair user for 20 years I very rarely look at or use the place market.
correct and tbh, this alone can be a useful little portfolio piece. basically, look at declared runners va actual runners (especially on 3 place market). you can sometimes find races where there were 8-9 declared and then 2-3 are withdrawn. same obviously goes for 4 places where you may have a 15 runner race with 4-5 withdrawn. etc...
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ANGELS15
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jimibt wrote:
Thu Oct 22, 2020 10:53 am
ANGELS15 wrote:
Thu Oct 22, 2020 10:47 am
Hi just a quick question on the subject of Betfair place terms:

Am I correct in understanding if you back a horse for a place on Betfair, let's say an 8 runner race with 3 places. If there was a withdrawal and you now have 7 runners you still get paid out on the 3rd place horse (albeit with a reduction)?

Surprisingly despite being a Betfair user for 20 years I very rarely look at or use the place market.
correct and tbh, this alone can be a useful little portfolio piece. basically, look at declared runners va actual runners (especially on 3 place market). you can sometimes find races where there were 8-9 declared and then 2-3 are withdrawn. same obviously goes for 4 places where you may have a 15 runner race with 4-5 withdrawn. etc...
Thanks for the clarification. Again if I understand in order to benefit from being paid out on the place in the event of withdrawals I believe you need to place the bet before the withdrawals? So if there was originally an 8 runner race, they withdrew 1 and you then placed your bet you wouldn't be covered for 3rd place. At least I'm sure that's what happened to me a few months ago when I did a place bet in a 7 runner field down from 8, my horse came 3rd but I wasn't paid out.
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firlandsfarm
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ANGELS15 wrote:
Thu Oct 22, 2020 9:40 pm
Thanks for the clarification. Again if I understand in order to benefit from being paid out on the place in the event of withdrawals I believe you need to place the bet before the withdrawals? So if there was originally an 8 runner race, they withdrew 1 and you then placed your bet you wouldn't be covered for 3rd place. At least I'm sure that's what happened to me a few months ago when I did a place bet in a 7 runner field down from 8, my horse came 3rd but I wasn't paid out.
No ... My understanding (of years ago) is that once Betfair set the number of places that's it ... cast in stone regardless of withdrawals except they have an exceptional situation clause if the number of runners left is equal to (or less than!) the number of runners. When you place your bet is irrelevant other than if before the withdrawal you will have the reduction factor deducted but if after the withdrawal there is no reduction factor, layers are expected to manage their unmatched bets.
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ANGELS15
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firlandsfarm wrote:
Fri Oct 23, 2020 5:54 am
ANGELS15 wrote:
Thu Oct 22, 2020 9:40 pm
Thanks for the clarification. Again if I understand in order to benefit from being paid out on the place in the event of withdrawals I believe you need to place the bet before the withdrawals? So if there was originally an 8 runner race, they withdrew 1 and you then placed your bet you wouldn't be covered for 3rd place. At least I'm sure that's what happened to me a few months ago when I did a place bet in a 7 runner field down from 8, my horse came 3rd but I wasn't paid out.
No ... My understanding (of years ago) is that once Betfair set the number of places that's it ... cast in stone regardless of withdrawals except they have an exceptional situation clause if the number of runners left is equal to (or less than!) the number of runners. When you place your bet is irrelevant other than if before the withdrawal you will have the reduction factor deducted but if after the withdrawal there is no reduction factor, layers are expected to manage their unmatched bets.
That's interesting, thanks for your input.
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firlandsfarm
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Have a look at Leicester 30/06/2020 17:45 TO BE PLACED. (Remember that's in the dwbfpricesukplace01072020.csv Betfair SP file). From my database there was originally 9 declarations but only 5 eventual runners ... the file shows 3 places were paid! There is no question of before or after a withdrawal.
LinusP
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Note that reduction factors are slightly different in place markets, its applied to the winnings rather than the price and there is no 2.5% minimum.
There is a difference on how the reduction factors work on 'Place' markets compared to 'Win' markets.

Win markets reduction factors are calculated to 100% when adding up all runners. In a 'Place' market a single horse has less impact on your chance of winning and reduction factor totals can be well over 200%.

The main difference between the two markets is that in a 'Place' market the reduction factor is applied to the potential winnings on the bet only and not to the traded price.

Example:
- You matched a back bet in a place market on the horse 'Diamond Night' for £10 @ 8.0.
- Your potential winning would be £10 x (8.0 - 1) = £70
- A horse in the same race is now withdrawn with a reduction factor of 25%
Your potential winning would be now £70 x (100% - 25%) = £70 x 75 / 100 = £52.50
Therefore the reversed traded price would be 6.25.
(In a win market a 25% Reduction Factor would calculated a price of 6.0).


Other differences of 'Place' markets:

All reduction factors will be applied (2.5% or less included)
Only if the reduction factor for a withdrawn horse is 4.0% or greater, all unmatched lay bets will be cancelled.
https://en-betfair.custhelp.com/app/ans ... l/a_id/406
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ANGELS15
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firlandsfarm wrote:
Fri Oct 23, 2020 11:09 am
Have a look at Leicester 30/06/2020 17:45 TO BE PLACED. (Remember that's in the dwbfpricesukplace01072020.csv Betfair SP file). From my database there was originally 9 declarations but only 5 eventual runners ... the file shows 3 places were paid! There is no question of before or after a withdrawal.
Again useful information thanks.
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