How 'Take SP' works

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Crumpets
Posts: 146
Joined: Fri Nov 05, 2021 4:38 pm

Had a funny situation this evening. I had closed a profitable trade on the fourth horse in a pre-race market. Then opened up a trade on the favourite. The favourite was in the red at the off, so with 'Take SP' selected, i hedged for an overall loss.

However, the loss sustained was more than double what i expected. The loss on the negative trade (favourite) was close to what was expected. But for some reason, taking SP opened up a lay bet on the fourth horse. Can anyone tell what SP specifically does? I thought it would only affect the horse which had an open position?

Is it possible that having my profit and loss calculated locally had any impact?
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Dallas
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It matches any unmatched bets you have at Betfair's SP

So sounds like you still had a unmatched bet on the 4th fav at the time you clicked 'Take SP'
You log would tell you what bet id's you changed to take SP
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Crumpets
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Joined: Fri Nov 05, 2021 4:38 pm

I checked my log. And i re-watched the recording. Just to make sure there were no fat fingers.

But no, i can guarantee my position on the fourth was closed. My log confirms the closure, then shows a back bet being placed on that horse as the race went in play. My mouse cursor never left the ladder of the favourite.

I'm stumped
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Dallas
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Location: Working From Home

Crumpets wrote:
Wed Feb 01, 2023 10:25 pm
I checked my log. And i re-watched the recording. Just to make sure there were no fat fingers.

But no, i can guarantee my position on the fourth was closed. My log confirms the closure, then shows a back bet being placed on that horse as the race went in play. My mouse cursor never left the ladder of the favourite.

I'm stumped
If it doesn't have 'Take SP' and its a new bet then it must have been placed some how, but without seeing the log for the market its impossible to be more precise
It may have been your P/L had failed to update or a servant/automation rule running possibly?
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Crumpets
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Joined: Fri Nov 05, 2021 4:38 pm

It appears i've left a stray order a long way below the touch price. Order at 7.4 which i forgot to cancel. Price had drifted up to 15 at the off. My guess is that when the ladders emptied at the off, the price came down low enough for a split second and matched me? But my adv chart shows that although the price momentarily pinged in, it only hit a low of 10s. (Maybe not picked up by the refresh rate i was using).
Also, i would of thought that all unmatched bets are cancelled at the off? Is it possible that there was a large back bet before the race suspended?
On my recording, the position opens exactly at the off, and shows red below 15s, and green above. The log shows where i hedged in play, but doesn't mention any bet being matched.

Would you recommend having p/l set locally? I have mine currently set at 400ms
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Crumpets
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I wasn't using any servants or automation
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ShaunWhite
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What price was your order for 7.4 matched at? It sounds like your unmatched bet at 7.4 was matched at SP if the red/green is at 15 and it showed up exactly at the start. That's what TakeSP does.

The refresh speed depends on what you're doing. 400ms is probably fine trading manually and closing before the off but the underlying market is actually ticking along at about 50 changes a second so any automation should be set to the highest possible rate.
Last edited by ShaunWhite on Thu Feb 02, 2023 1:24 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Crumpets
Posts: 146
Joined: Fri Nov 05, 2021 4:38 pm

think the conclusion is that any unmatched bets will get matched at the off, if 'Take SP' is selected. Though they will get matched at the SP. I always thought Take SP simply closed any open trades, but it seems it also opens them, as the default 'cancel' (when turning in play) has been overridden.

So in my case, clicking Take SP ensured i was out on the favourite. But it also meant i was back in on the fourth. Obviously not great considering my unmatched lay order at 7.4 was matched at 15s 😳 in play 😳

Well now i know.

...Just read your post, Shaun. Quite confident that is exactly what happened.
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ShaunWhite
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Joined: Sat Sep 03, 2016 3:42 am

TakeSP will never create a bet, but it will change the bet type of any unmatched bets so that they are matched at SP if they haven't already been matched by that time. That means they don't get cancelled as per the default because the default cancel has been overridden with a Take SP.
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ShaunWhite
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Joined: Sat Sep 03, 2016 3:42 am

... Here you go....
https://www.betangel.com/user-guide/bet ... _bets.html?

If you have unmatched bets there are three possible things that can happen when the market turns in-play:

The bet is cancelled (Default)
The bet is kept in the market - Keep All feature
The bet is matched at the Betfair Starting Price (BSP) - Take SP feature
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Crumpets
Posts: 146
Joined: Fri Nov 05, 2021 4:38 pm

Thank you both for the explanation! I'll have to be more aware of strays going forwards. An old in-play habit has caused me to spam the SP button it seems. So that'll change; now that i know the real function of it.

Dallas, you gave the correct answer hours ago...apologies 🙏
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ShaunWhite
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Joined: Sat Sep 03, 2016 3:42 am

I don't really use it but isn't there a TakeSp and a seperate TakeSp All button on the unmatched bets list? That would stop you from SPing the bets that aren't on the screen maybe.
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