Negative Balance

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Dylan711
Posts: 4
Joined: Sun Jan 16, 2022 1:17 pm

My account has gone negative due to some lay bets being made void in a market that didn’t have the rule 4 deductions applied to it. If I never use my betfair account again and leave the balance as negative or just outright request the account to be closed, will anything happen? Will they chase the liability. I’m based in Australia if that helps.
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Euler
Posts: 24701
Joined: Wed Nov 10, 2010 1:39 pm
Location: Bet Angel HQ

Betfair will try to collect money from a negative account.
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MobiusGrey
Posts: 289
Joined: Fri Nov 23, 2018 8:10 pm

I don't want to give any wrong advice so I won't give any advice at all other than an anecdote from a few years ago;

There was a thread on Money Saving Expert where someone told everyone to start laying correct scorers on Betfair, I think it was around the FA Cup final or something. Anyway, a load of people with no knowledge of either football or betting decided to all pile on. Betfair then pulled all the 'non runners' and voided bets when the teams were announced and all of a sudden a lot of people were set to lose thousands, I think some had a liability of -£12,000, panic duly set in and people started discussing legal action and doing a runner.

Long story short, Betfair didn't pursue anyone for any money and just closed the accounts. The thread is absolutely hilarious but I don't think it exists any longer.
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psychoff
Posts: 91
Joined: Wed Apr 15, 2009 2:52 pm
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If you dont use that account anymore, nothing happens. If you ever deposit, they will deduct that amount from your deposit.
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Kai
Posts: 6092
Joined: Tue Jan 20, 2015 12:21 pm

Dylan711 wrote:
Sun Jan 16, 2022 1:24 pm
Hey guys just wanted your opinion on this.

I had some lay bets on the Aus Open Outright market on Djokovic. The odds drifted out and gave me a positive cash out option. For whatever reason, after I cashed out, betfair laid all the other players for varying amounts to give me say +$100 for all players. Thought it was weird but it was effectively a cash out by laying all players.

I then layed Novak again shortly after and I was immediately given a positive cash out and the same thing happened again (laid all other players). I did this multiple times but wasn’t able to continuously as some of the players had no liquidity so I had no cash option available. Just before Novak got booted (a couple hours ago) I had a completely green book for all players of about $1500. After Novak got voided, my book is now negative $8000 for every player. My balance is negative $3800. I have reached out to customer service but they are still discussing cash outs apparently for the market, what the fuck that means. Any advice would be greatly appreciated, absolutely tilted off my head at the moment. Will have to take this to the Gaming Commission (I’m from Australia) if this doesn’t get sorted.
Sorry to hear that Dylan, we all heard similar stories before where people thought they were on to some very easy money, it's quite an expensive lesson if it means losing your Betfair account as well.

I think one of the key lessons here is that it's better to manually manage your positions to keep your trading execution as clean as possible, the cashout feature may be convenient to use but it's not very efficient.
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Derek27
Posts: 23477
Joined: Wed Aug 30, 2017 11:44 am
Location: UK

MobiusGrey wrote:
Sun Jan 16, 2022 2:46 pm
I don't want to give any wrong advice so I won't give any advice at all other than an anecdote from a few years ago;

There was a thread on Money Saving Expert where someone told everyone to start laying correct scorers on Betfair, I think it was around the FA Cup final or something. Anyway, a load of people with no knowledge of either football or betting decided to all pile on. Betfair then pulled all the 'non runners' and voided bets when the teams were announced and all of a sudden a lot of people were set to lose thousands, I think some had a liability of -£12,000, panic duly set in and people started discussing legal action and doing a runner.

Long story short, Betfair didn't pursue anyone for any money and just closed the accounts. The thread is absolutely hilarious but I don't think it exists any longer.
I think that was a first goalscorer market and they were oblivious to the fact that a player was known not to be playing, hence, the overround was skewed. :)
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Dallas
Posts: 22674
Joined: Sun Aug 09, 2015 10:57 pm
Location: Working From Home

MobiusGrey wrote:
Sun Jan 16, 2022 2:46 pm
I don't want to give any wrong advice so I won't give any advice at all other than an anecdote from a few years ago;

There was a thread on Money Saving Expert where someone told everyone to start laying correct scorers on Betfair, I think it was around the FA Cup final or something. Anyway, a load of people with no knowledge of either football or betting decided to all pile on. Betfair then pulled all the 'non runners' and voided bets when the teams were announced and all of a sudden a lot of people were set to lose thousands, I think some had a liability of -£12,000, panic duly set in and people started discussing legal action and doing a runner.

Long story short, Betfair didn't pursue anyone for any money and just closed the accounts. The thread is absolutely hilarious but I don't think it exists any longer.
Unfortunately it was taken down a few years ago but there's a link to the forum thread on here which appeared in its aftermath in the blog of Peter's about betting into false markets
https://www.betfairtradingblog.com/betf ... ergar-cup/
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Derek27
Posts: 23477
Joined: Wed Aug 30, 2017 11:44 am
Location: UK

Great shame it's been taken down. The fact that it was on Money Saving Experts was irony that could never be toppled!
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Kai
Posts: 6092
Joined: Tue Jan 20, 2015 12:21 pm

Unfortunately these types of "opportunities" are exactly where FOMO can mess someone up, people that haven't read the fine print start thinking it's one of those unique one-of-a-kind opportunities and they go all in. But you have to ask yourself at some point, if it's too obvious then surely it's obviously wrong?
Dylan711
Posts: 4
Joined: Sun Jan 16, 2022 1:17 pm

Cheers for the responses guys, my fault for not reading into the market better. Gonna just forget about this BF account and never touch it again. Will have to create an account using my partners details
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Derek27
Posts: 23477
Joined: Wed Aug 30, 2017 11:44 am
Location: UK

Dylan711 wrote:
Sun Jan 16, 2022 11:26 pm
Cheers for the responses guys, my fault for not reading into the market better. Gonna just forget about this BF account and never touch it again. Will have to create an account using my partners details
Sorry to be the bearer of bad news but it may not be so straightforward. If your partner's living with you they'll quickly link your two accounts. If not, their algorithms may detect similar betting patterns and link them anyway. They do this to stop people from avoiding premium charge by opening another account. Under their rules, they reserve the right to link accounts if they have evidence to believe the same person is using them, in which case they may grab deposits in your partner's account.
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jamesedwards
Posts: 2234
Joined: Wed Nov 21, 2018 6:16 pm

Dylan711 wrote:
Sun Jan 16, 2022 11:26 pm
Cheers for the responses guys, my fault for not reading into the market better. Gonna just forget about this BF account and never touch it again. Will have to create an account using my partners details
Be careful. I have no experience of this myself, but Betfair are supposedly very good at spotting duplicate accounts these days due to their efforts against Premium Charge avoidance. If you want to be certain of having access to Betfair in the future I would seriously consider whether it's worth coughing up to cover the negative balance in order to keep the account.
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ShaunWhite
Posts: 9731
Joined: Sat Sep 03, 2016 3:42 am

Dylan711 wrote:
Sun Jan 16, 2022 11:26 pm
Will have to create an account using my partners details
I hope your relationship is strong enough that they won't do a runner with it. :shock: If it's strong then do you have the same address and any plans to share a surname one day? Like James said it's just better to cough up than spend the rest of your gambling life looking over your shoulder.
Anbell
Posts: 2004
Joined: Fri Apr 05, 2019 2:31 am

Dylan711 wrote:
Sun Jan 16, 2022 11:26 pm
Cheers for the responses guys, my fault for not reading into the market better. Gonna just forget about this BF account and never touch it again. Will have to create an account using my partners details
That's literally stealing.
foxwood
Posts: 390
Joined: Mon Jul 23, 2012 2:54 pm

Anbell wrote:
Mon Jan 17, 2022 6:32 am
Dylan711 wrote:
Sun Jan 16, 2022 11:26 pm
Cheers for the responses guys, my fault for not reading into the market better. Gonna just forget about this BF account and never touch it again. Will have to create an account using my partners details
That's literally stealing.
Yup - but KYC will match it and stop future withdrawals if there are winnings
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