Smarkets's skullduggery

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spreadbetting
Posts: 3140
Joined: Sun Jan 31, 2010 8:06 pm

Naffman wrote:
Sat Nov 17, 2018 6:00 pm
Just read about it again and genuinely can't believe it, say you're trading a horse at 6.0 and stake about £3k on both sides...if the horse wins you pay 1% not on the turnover (3k) but 1% on 3k x 5 (6.0 or 5/1) so that's £150!!! Even if the horse loses you'll still pay £30.

Absolute joke of a company, had high hopes for them too but this is worse than Betfair and Matchbook's PC put together!
Yep, you just have to hope the horse you're trading doesn't go onto to win at those higher prices. £1500 either side of a trade around 6's means you need at least 4-6 ticks just to break even depending on which way the market moves on a winner as both opening and closing trades will attract charges. At least it should kill off any competition to market make at higher prices leaving a blank canvas for the in house traders.
lizzard
Posts: 1
Joined: Mon Nov 30, 2020 6:48 pm

This deserves a bump...

Been using Smarkets for the past month (don't ask) - its def NOT an exchange, at least one that is "fair and transparent".

Case in point - been laying 0-0 in the correct score football market for a bit of fun (no value in the over 0.5 goals market given retail odds).

Been having some success and built decent bank. Initially was able to green out lay back easily at default 1000/0-1 once goal had been scored (the over 0.5 goals market does auto settle but as mentioned, odds are sportbook esque). Gradually noticed the time taken for green up bet to match was taking longer - to the extent that it won't now' get matched at all/ or is painfully slow e.g. 1p per 30/40 seconds.

Checked with customer support to see if my account/ speed to green up was being limited. The answer was resoundingly NO.

I wasn't convinced and asked a mate to take the same available bet at 10000-1 on the same match when a goal had been scored. LO AND BEHOLD it was matched instantly.

As thread notes, the counterparty I'm betting against is probably Smarkets/Hansons....

Is this legal behaviour for a purported exchange? Can I escalate this anywhere?

Thanks in advance
stueytrader
Posts: 816
Joined: Tue Dec 15, 2015 6:47 pm

One thing to add as recent update.

Recently I've mostly been using Betdaq and Smarkets rather than BF.

Early market action on Smarkets is better than Betdaq IMO - the purple one often dead for any early market action, while Smarkets has decent enough early money around.

Just a small (positive) comparison for Smarkets, as I note a lot of negativity around towards the place.
stueytrader
Posts: 816
Joined: Tue Dec 15, 2015 6:47 pm

I presume the reason most on this forum are anti is because it won't allow Betangel use there?

Fairly obvious and fair criticism.
Mikepcon
Posts: 1
Joined: Thu Sep 15, 2022 11:22 pm

I have been using smarkets for 10 years now and generally find them reliable though they do mess up at times.
They have closed my account today and despite numerous requests by me for an a reason they refuse to give it. Looks to me as the easy way to say we don't close winning accounts is just to refuse to give a reason. If I've done something wrong then why not just give me some indication of what that is. It's no Coincidence that I've just had my best few months ever on smarkets.
Anyway... That's up to them. It's their business so if they choose to close winning accounts so be it. Just stop denying it.

I saw other comments in this thread about throttling. 100% they do it.
Maybe 2 years ago a friend and I spotted some golf bets that arbed between smarkets and betfair.
He did a few... Stakes taken on smarkets and then instantly available again.
I did some... Stakes disappeared almost immediately.
From time to time we check it out on some markets....and it's always the same. He gets stakes matched within seconds. I either see all the liquidity disappear or I get a few pound matched every 5 mins or so.
It is completely obvious they are in done way sharing customer data with other parties.
Undeniable
And probably illegal.
Id like to see Jason Truss deny that one.

They will close your account if you hit a good run.... But they will just quote clause 2.10
So they don't have to justify it

Jason.... Ive emailed you and would appreciate a reply.
kwazulunatal
Posts: 1
Joined: Fri Sep 23, 2022 9:00 am

I too had my account closed on 15th September with the same message of 'because we say so'.. I was one of the earliest to sign up and have turned over huge amounts and paid untold amounts of commission over the years. There were markets where I was the only one taking other customers bets as the Smarkets 'trader' wouldn't get involved and offered nothing. Without my trading I'm sure some of the customer base would have gone elsewhere especially in the early days. I reduced my trading after the 2018 changes due to the limits applied but now they have finally gone down the route of every betting business today i.e. no winners allowed. Jason - you have not revolutionized betting you are part of the herd.
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Euler
Posts: 22944
Joined: Wed Nov 10, 2010 1:39 pm
Location: Bet Angel HQ

stueytrader wrote:
Sun Feb 21, 2021 11:31 am
I presume the reason most on this forum are anti is because it won't allow Betangel use there?

Fairly obvious and fair criticism.
That and the fact they are active in their own markets. Same problem with Matchbook to be fair. It's always going to be a long term problem if you are basically winning against the house.
Stats101
Posts: 38
Joined: Mon Nov 14, 2016 11:55 pm

My account was also closed last week, with no reason given.

I had generated approaching £50,000 worth of commission over the past couple of years, having been put on the 3% Select Tier.

As Euler mentions, I am assuming I was making too much profit in markets seeded by themselves or their market makers. I also had my Matchbook account closed a couple of years ago, with them citing that the reason my account was closed was to protect their market makers.
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wearthefoxhat
Posts: 2798
Joined: Sun Feb 18, 2018 9:55 am

Stats101 wrote:
Sat Sep 24, 2022 9:59 am
My account was also closed last week, with no reason given.

I had generated approaching £50,000 worth of commission over the past couple of years, having been put on the 3% Select Tier.

As Euler mentions, I am assuming I was making too much profit in markets seeded by themselves or their market makers. I also had my Matchbook account closed a couple of years ago, with them citing that the reason my account was closed was to protect their market makers.
Where do you go next?
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Naffman
Posts: 5186
Joined: Sun Aug 11, 2013 5:46 am

I have no idea how Smarkets make their money, barely anyone seems can keep their trading account open as they market make and has anyone even heard of SBK (sportsbook)
Emmson
Posts: 2792
Joined: Mon Feb 29, 2016 6:47 pm

vide0star wrote:
Mon Oct 08, 2018 8:04 pm
ANGELS15 wrote:
Mon Oct 08, 2018 11:23 am
This backs up a lot of negative reviews I've read. typically they seem to close accounts if people win too often which now figures if they're using their own money to lay. also one trader said they complained because he 'greened up' too often! Avoid.
We have never, not once, never closed a customer's account for winning.
:?: :?: :?: :?: :?: :?: :?: :?: :?: :?: :?: :?: :?: :?:
Stats101
Posts: 38
Joined: Mon Nov 14, 2016 11:55 pm

wearthefoxhat wrote:
Sat Sep 24, 2022 12:10 pm
Stats101 wrote:
Sat Sep 24, 2022 9:59 am
My account was also closed last week, with no reason given.

I had generated approaching £50,000 worth of commission over the past couple of years, having been put on the 3% Select Tier.

As Euler mentions, I am assuming I was making too much profit in markets seeded by themselves or their market makers. I also had my Matchbook account closed a couple of years ago, with them citing that the reason my account was closed was to protect their market makers.
Where do you go next?
Despite my frustration at the 40% Premium Charge on Betfair, I am thankful that an exchange exists that doesn't ban profitable traders.

Having traded for a living since 2008, I am now feeling like I am coming to the end of my independent trading career. I am lucky to still be successful in Betfair, but am finding I am working more hours to maintain a similar level of income.

As I am approaching my 40s, I am contemplating a change of direction that might give me a better work life balance. I am sure I will still do this part time though to make a few extra pennies.
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