Fat Finger Guardian Automation Bot

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Dallas
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8ballprowler wrote:
Thu Mar 11, 2021 7:49 pm
What about if the fat finger (spike) goes in the opposite direction?
If one breaks down this bot and then uses the opposite parameters so to speak to create an upward fat finger. Would that work?
Cheers.
Yes, you could look for an upward spike, these happen less often but I'd guess there's also going to be less people looking for them
8ballprowler
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Joined: Tue Feb 14, 2017 10:25 am

Cheers Dallas.
bests3lleruk
Posts: 20
Joined: Wed Apr 01, 2020 7:58 pm

Hi Dallas, Just a quick question. So I changed all the lay amounts to £2 from £10. I also added the same rules for more rows. All I want to know is, does this work in the other direction by backing as well? Or could that be set up? Also I've never used guardian before, is it best to just leave guardian up and your computer on over-night if you're monitoring tomorrows markets for instance? Also finally I noticed a couple of these (or something like it) happened yesterday during the liveshows, so what is to stop this triggering and then never greening-up as the race goes in-play before the required time has elapsed for the green-up? Thanks.
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Dallas
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bests3lleruk wrote:
Thu Jul 29, 2021 7:24 pm
Hi Dallas, Just a quick question. So I changed all the lay amounts to £2 from £10. I also added the same rules for more rows. All I want to know is, does this work in the other direction by backing as well? Or could that be set up? Also I've never used guardian before, is it best to just leave guardian up and your computer on over-night if you're monitoring tomorrows markets for instance? Also finally I noticed a couple of these (or something like it) happened yesterday during the liveshows, so what is to stop this triggering and then never greening-up as the race goes in-play before the required time has elapsed for the green-up? Thanks.
To do it in the other direction on each of the 'Store Low Price' rules
add another stored value (you could name this high)
Plus 25 ticks (or however many you want to use)

*You could then rename these rules just to 'Store Prices' if you wanted

Next add the back bet rules with a stored value condition to test the;
price is 'greater' than
a stored value named 'high' (or whatever you called it)

You can also add a 'In-play condition' to all the back and lay rules to test the market is NOT in-play

You don't need to have Guardian open once the rules have been applied to your markets but you must remain logged into Bet Angel and have an active connection to Betfair, so ensure you have disabled sleep/hibernation mode etc on your PC
bests3lleruk
Posts: 20
Joined: Wed Apr 01, 2020 7:58 pm

Hi, I had this bot running today and it did this:

02/08/2021 08:34:01: £ 5.00 Lay bet placed on Mejthaam at 2.86. Entirely unmatched when it initially reached the market. Ref: 239834233462
02/08/2021 08:34:16: £ 5.00 Lay bet placed on Mejthaam at 2.92. Entirely unmatched when it initially reached the market. Ref: 239834241070
02/08/2021 08:34:17: Cancelling bets 239834233462
02/08/2021 08:34:38: Cancelling bets 239834241070

I'm just wondering, why did it cancel the bets? There doesn't seem to be any timer on when or if the bets are accepted by the market? What makes it cancel the bets after what appears to be around 16 seconds for the first one and then 22 seconds for the second? Also, when this bot 'greens up', will it green up the entire market or just the selection it's been triggered with? And lastly the other day I was running it and changed something like the number of ticks required to trigger it and for some reason it triggered twice in close succession? Why is this when I thought there is a rule that it only triggers once? Thanks for any help you can offer.
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Dallas
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bests3lleruk wrote:
Mon Aug 02, 2021 12:08 pm
Hi, I had this bot running today and it did this:

02/08/2021 08:34:01: £ 5.00 Lay bet placed on Mejthaam at 2.86. Entirely unmatched when it initially reached the market. Ref: 239834233462
02/08/2021 08:34:16: £ 5.00 Lay bet placed on Mejthaam at 2.92. Entirely unmatched when it initially reached the market. Ref: 239834241070
02/08/2021 08:34:17: Cancelling bets 239834233462
02/08/2021 08:34:38: Cancelling bets 239834241070

I'm just wondering, why did it cancel the bets? There doesn't seem to be any timer on when or if the bets are accepted by the market? What makes it cancel the bets after what appears to be around 16 seconds for the first one and then 22 seconds for the second? Also, when this bot 'greens up', will it green up the entire market or just the selection it's been triggered with? And lastly the other day I was running it and changed something like the number of ticks required to trigger it and for some reason it triggered twice in close succession? Why is this when I thought there is a rule that it only triggers once? Thanks for any help you can offer.

There are no cancel instructions in the rules file so it must of come from Betfair for some reason, its usually very rare but they can sometimes close and reopen and market with a new ID in the morning if there's been enough withdrawn runners etc

It will green them all up, you can if you want change this and add rules to green up each selection individually, but the green all probably works best in this instance.

If a rule is applied to a market and you make a change and re-save it, it will be like you've just re-applied it to the market again, so any rules thats already triggered will be able to trigger again.

If re-saving you are best removing it from a market, cancelling any existing unmatched bets the re-applying after the changes have been saved.
bests3lleruk
Posts: 20
Joined: Wed Apr 01, 2020 7:58 pm

A couple of things firstly this fat finger bot has activated on heavily backed runners a few times in the past few days. It's not a 'fat finger' that's triggering it but just something heavily backed. The only things I changed was I added more rows and I changed the ticks trigger to 20 from 25. Yet several times it's been triggered by horses just being well backed in the morning? It's almost as if it's taking the initial lowest range value and then not continually updating it, so if the horse gets backed in 20 ticks during the morning or afternoon or whatever it activates. This way obviously I'm lucky if it ever gets back to a position to green up and if it does it's a tiny profit but if it doesn't I'm left with the lay and a big deficit. Also I set another bot as a variation of the fat finger one that was supposed to lay horses in competitive handicaps that went under their traded range by so many ticks and then 'green up' 4 seconds before the off to 4 seconds after the official off time, and this works usually but today for some reason it just triggered the lay bet then didn't trigger the green-up bet? I think automation seems too risky to me. It seems to work sometimes and not other times for no apparent reason. Maybe they get cancelled by Betfair or something gets lost in translation I don't know.

Here's an example of the handicap bot working correctly:

03/08/2021 16:15:31: [G_Auto] : Automation Signal for French Conquest: triggered = 1
03/08/2021 16:15:32: [G_Auto] : £ 1.16 Lay bet placed on French Conquest at 5.3. Fully matched at 5.3. Ref: 239936849574
03/08/2021 16:44:58: [G_Auto] : Placed closure bet with greening on French Conquest by Backing 1.14 at 5.4
03/08/2021 16:47:33: Guardian has detected that the market is in-play
03/08/2021 16:47:33: Guardian has detected that the market is suspended
03/08/2021 16:47:55: Guardian has detected that the market is now unsuspended
03/08/2021 16:49:46: Guardian has detected that the market is suspended

Then for no apparent reason it did this:

03/08/2021 15:06:00: [G_Auto] : Automation Signal for Excellent George: triggered = 1
03/08/2021 15:06:01: [G_Auto] : £ 1.72 Lay bet placed on Excellent George at 3.9. Fully matched at 3.9. Ref: 239932137482
03/08/2021 15:11:15: Guardian has detected that the market is in-play
03/08/2021 15:11:15: Guardian has detected that the market is suspended
03/08/2021 15:11:46: Guardian has detected that the market is now unsuspended
03/08/2021 15:12:18: Guardian has detected that the market is suspended


The green up just didn't trigger? It's the same rule being used so I don't know how this can happen. And obviously sod's law that horse won. Thankfully it was tiny stakes as I was just testing it.
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ShaunWhite
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bests3lleruk wrote:
Tue Aug 03, 2021 5:00 pm
I think automation seems too risky to me. It seems to work sometimes and not other times for no apparent reason. Maybe they get cancelled by Betfair or something gets lost in translation I don't know.
Thousands of people use automation every day on BetAngel and other software, there's nothing risky about it. If it's not working as you'd expect then it will be the instructions you're giving it.
Anbell
Posts: 2004
Joined: Fri Apr 05, 2019 2:31 am

The race where it didnt green up could be a refresh-rate / Guardian-cycle issue. It looks like there was only a 10 second window available.
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Dallas
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bests3lleruk wrote:
Tue Aug 03, 2021 5:00 pm
A couple of things firstly this fat finger bot has activated on heavily backed runners a few times in the past few days. It's not a 'fat finger' that's triggering it but just something heavily backed. The only things I changed was I added more rows and I changed the ticks trigger to 20 from 25. Yet several times it's been triggered by horses just being well backed in the morning? It's almost as if it's taking the initial lowest range value and then not continually updating it
If you are running it from the evening before have you increased the number of times the Stored Value can trigger and update the lowest traded price?

It was set to trigger 1200 times every 30 seconds, so will run out of triggers after 10 hours.
If you are applying it the night before and haven't changed these the last time it will store the lowest price will be sometime early that morning.
bests3lleruk
Posts: 20
Joined: Wed Apr 01, 2020 7:58 pm

Dallas wrote:
Wed Aug 04, 2021 11:36 am
bests3lleruk wrote:
Tue Aug 03, 2021 5:00 pm
A couple of things firstly this fat finger bot has activated on heavily backed runners a few times in the past few days. It's not a 'fat finger' that's triggering it but just something heavily backed. The only things I changed was I added more rows and I changed the ticks trigger to 20 from 25. Yet several times it's been triggered by horses just being well backed in the morning? It's almost as if it's taking the initial lowest range value and then not continually updating it
If you are running it from the evening before have you increased the number of times the Stored Value can trigger and update the lowest traded price?

It was set to trigger 1200 times every 30 seconds, so will run out of triggers after 10 hours.
If you are applying it the night before and haven't changed these the last time it will store the lowest price will be sometime early that morning.

Yes that is probably it. I didn't think of that. But what about the one I posted whereby the bot didn't green up? It does usually but on that occasion it just failed? What could I do about that? Maybe I could make it green up more times or something? In case it misses it for some reason? This is how I have it set I have it set to green up from 5 seconds before the official off time until 5 seconds after it. Maybe it somehow for some reason missed this window? How do I make sure it greens up by the off time? Thanks.
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Dallas
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bests3lleruk wrote:
Thu Aug 05, 2021 4:07 am
Dallas wrote:
Wed Aug 04, 2021 11:36 am
bests3lleruk wrote:
Tue Aug 03, 2021 5:00 pm
A couple of things firstly this fat finger bot has activated on heavily backed runners a few times in the past few days. It's not a 'fat finger' that's triggering it but just something heavily backed. The only things I changed was I added more rows and I changed the ticks trigger to 20 from 25. Yet several times it's been triggered by horses just being well backed in the morning? It's almost as if it's taking the initial lowest range value and then not continually updating it
If you are running it from the evening before have you increased the number of times the Stored Value can trigger and update the lowest traded price?

It was set to trigger 1200 times every 30 seconds, so will run out of triggers after 10 hours.
If you are applying it the night before and haven't changed these the last time it will store the lowest price will be sometime early that morning.

Yes that is probably it. I didn't think of that. But what about the one I posted whereby the bot didn't green up? It does usually but on that occasion it just failed? What could I do about that? Maybe I could make it green up more times or something? In case it misses it for some reason? This is how I have it set I have it set to green up from 5 seconds before the official off time until 5 seconds after it. Maybe it somehow for some reason missed this window? How do I make sure it greens up by the off time? Thanks.
The green up rules in the original files only have two conditions
1) using a Signal condition will trigger 60-900 secs after the opening bet is placed
2) you are in profit

If you have added extra green up rules to work the same way but on additional runners make sure on your additional lay bets you duplicated them (so they have the signal set command, or if you added them manually you remembered to add the signal set part.
bests3lleruk
Posts: 20
Joined: Wed Apr 01, 2020 7:58 pm

Okay but on my handicap bot while I developed it from the fat finger bot, I deleted the 'conditions' and I have it simply to green up from 5 seconds before the start time to 5 seconds after the start time (under rule trigger times in the general tab). The reason I did this is I want it to just settle up before the off regardless of if I'm in profit or not. So what I'm asking is how do I make this rule more robust as it appeared to miss it once but other times it worked. Maybe I give a bigger window for it to trigger and more times for it to trigger? It is currently set at 'allow rule to trigger up to 2 times'. Should I make the window bigger and maybe choose 'unlimited triggers'? If it only triggers until you're greened up, why don't you always just choose that option? Thanks for your help.
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