Missing horse racing markets in Betfair Historical Data

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racepunter
Posts: 8
Joined: Sun Apr 30, 2023 4:10 pm

Hi, guys.

I'm new at this forum, so please excuse me if the problem described below has already been discussed here but I have not noticed it.

I want to do some back testings using two datasets: Betfair Historical Data & Betfair Price Data. I just need data from the both sources.

Yesterday I downloaded the both datasets containing data from May 2015 to June 2023 using Basic Plan but was very disappointed when the very first files that I started to look through had a very serious problem - the lack of markets in the Historical Database. That is, these markets are in the Price Database, but they are not in the Historical Database.
For example, I checked Win Markets in UK for 26.12.2017. That day there were 57 runs in UK, but Betfair Historical Data Base has 24 only!

Guys, maybe I made some mistake? Although the data for that day were downloaded twice: first, I downloaded all the data myself yesterday for the period indicated above. Then today, when I saw the problem, I asked my friend to download the data only for 26.12.2017, and after we compared our datasets, they were the same.

What could be the problem in? Maybe this is related to the data for 2017 and earlier?
I suppose that the same problem can be with the data that is bought with Pro and Advanced plans. But how then do people pay such big money for the missing data?

I will appreciate any discussions.
racepunter
Posts: 8
Joined: Sun Apr 30, 2023 4:10 pm

It is really strange that nobody posted any comments here.

Guys, do you not have any problems with your Historical Database?
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xtrader16
Posts: 407
Joined: Sun Feb 26, 2017 1:00 pm

Hi, It is not that unusual to not get a response from people within 24 hours on the forum. The vast Majority wouldn't have even read your post online. Then, if they don't have any information to assist you they will just move on without comment. Very few people I guess will have downloaded the Historical Data from Betfair recently. For some reason I struggle to to download anything , not sure why it just wont let me. (about 5 years since I tried). Apart from 2-3 people such as Euler and Dallas most people will hi-jack your post with some annoying separate issue like an old Atari game from 1985 and take it off in a tangent without ever addressing your Opening Post. Sorry, I don't know anything about Historical Data in Betfair as I rarely use it.
racepunter
Posts: 8
Joined: Sun Apr 30, 2023 4:10 pm

xtrader16 wrote:
Mon Jun 05, 2023 12:23 pm
I don't know anything about Historical Data in Betfair as I rarely use it.
But how do you use it if it is so incomplete?
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xtrader16
Posts: 407
Joined: Sun Feb 26, 2017 1:00 pm

racepunter wrote:
Mon Jun 05, 2023 4:00 pm
xtrader16 wrote:
Mon Jun 05, 2023 12:23 pm
I don't know anything about Historical Data in Betfair as I rarely use it.
But how do you use it if it is so incomplete?
I don't. What exactly is missing. Is it races or part of races? I don't know. knowing Betfair they probably just don't care if it is there or not. Do what you can with what you have got.
racepunter
Posts: 8
Joined: Sun Apr 30, 2023 4:10 pm

xtrader16 wrote:
Mon Jun 05, 2023 4:38 pm
What exactly is missing. Is it races or part of races?
In my 1st post I stated what was missing. And it was one day only that I mentioned. There were a lot of such days in BF DB.
Last edited by racepunter on Tue Jun 06, 2023 9:09 am, edited 1 time in total.
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xtrader16
Posts: 407
Joined: Sun Feb 26, 2017 1:00 pm

I can only assume Betfair just recorded some of the races that they thought they needed to. I wouldn't worry about there being 57 races that day and only 26 races have recorded data. I would just assess the 26 races that you do have and work from that. I don't recognise
Historical data, from 2017, to be relevant in 2023 but I'm am usually wrong anyway. Good Luck.
racepunter
Posts: 8
Joined: Sun Apr 30, 2023 4:10 pm

xtrader16 wrote:
Tue Jun 06, 2023 12:03 am
I would just assess the 26 races that you do have and work from that.
It is a very strange approach.

Imagine the following situation: in 26 races your strategy would show you, say, 50% of the winners, and your profit would be +30 units.
And in the remaining 31 races your strategy would not give a single winner and you would have a loss - 31 units. But according to your strategy you need to bet on all 57 races.

This is why the accuracy and completeness of historical data is so important.
Anbell
Posts: 1968
Joined: Fri Apr 05, 2019 2:31 am

racepunter wrote:
Tue Jun 06, 2023 9:24 am
xtrader16 wrote:
Tue Jun 06, 2023 12:03 am
I would just assess the 26 races that you do have and work from that.
It is a very strange approach.

Imagine the following situation: in 26 races your strategy would show you, say, 50% of the winners, and your profit would be +30 units.
And in the remaining 31 races your strategy would not give a single winner and you would have a loss - 31 units. But according to your strategy you need to bet on all 57 races.

This is why the accuracy and completeness of historical data is so important.
Try a more recent day
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ODPaul82
Posts: 670
Joined: Sun May 08, 2011 6:32 am
Location: Digswell Herts

Up until about 2017 (may have been 2018) betfair used to supply CSV files for download on a weekly basis, one set for horses and another for other sports

These would break down by odds how many bets had been taken on each selection and the total matched at those odds as well.
At a guess there was some cross-over and I imagine they're probably not that bothered themselves about data that historic.
I've attached a sample of what the horses one contained.
sample.xls
Their terms & conditions do caveat about potential completeness.
[No warranty or liability: The Historical Data is provided "AS IS". Betfair does not make or give, nor has any servant or agent of Betfair the authority to make or give, any representation, warranty or undertaking (express or implied) as to, and none of Betfair or its Group Companies accept any liability in respect of, the accuracy, completeness, reliability, timeliness, currency or quality of the Historical Data or its correspondence with description or as to its fitness for a particular purpose.
/i]

If you're desperate for the data from 2017 how about pinging their support an email?
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.
racepunter
Posts: 8
Joined: Sun Apr 30, 2023 4:10 pm

Anbell wrote:
Tue Jun 06, 2023 11:56 pm
Try a more recent day
I thought about it. But yesterday I found the problem for 04.03.2023. Naas was missing at all, i.e., no races for that event.

Besides in 10 races there was no data about volumes.
statusllama
Posts: 1
Joined: Mon Dec 25, 2023 8:22 am

racepunter wrote:
Sun Jun 04, 2023 1:11 pm
Hi, guys.

I'm new at this forum, so please excuse me if the problem described below has already been discussed here but I have not noticed it.

I want to do some back testings using two datasets: Betfair Historical Data & Betfair Price Data. I just need data from the both sources.

Yesterday I downloaded the both datasets containing data from May 2015 to June 2023 using Basic Plan but was very disappointed when the very first files that I started to look through had a very serious problem - the lack of markets in the Historical Database. That is, these markets are in the Price Database, but they are not in the Historical Database.
For example, I checked Win Markets in UK for 26.12.2017. That day there were 57 runs in UK, but Betfair Historical Data Base has 24 only!

Guys, maybe I made some mistake? Although the data for that day were downloaded twice: first, I downloaded all the data myself yesterday for the period indicated above. Then today, when I saw the problem, I asked my friend to download the data only for 26.12.2017, and after we compared our datasets, they were the same.

What could be the problem in? Maybe this is related to the data for 2017 and earlier?
I suppose that the same problem can be with the data that is bought with Pro and Advanced plans. But how then do people pay such big money for the missing data?

I will appreciate any discussions.
snake io
I ran into the identical issue you did not too long ago. I stumbled into your question by accident. You will lose thirty-one units if your approach does not produce a single victory in the final thirty-one races. However, your plan dictates that you must wager on each of the 57 races. For this reason, the completeness and accuracy of historical data are crucial.
collegequarrel
Posts: 2
Joined: Wed Oct 19, 2022 9:50 am

I adore this piece much moresnake io. I would suggest that every betting organization has a different strategy for generating revenue from current clients in order to attract new ones. Nevertheless, in the long run, these fresh ones will become oldies. It always works like that.
Anbell
Posts: 1968
Joined: Fri Apr 05, 2019 2:31 am

racepunter wrote:
Wed Jun 07, 2023 6:50 am
Anbell wrote:
Tue Jun 06, 2023 11:56 pm
Try a more recent day
I thought about it. But yesterday I found the problem for 04.03.2023. Naas was missing at all, i.e., no races for that event.

Besides in 10 races there was no data about volumes.
According to the spec sheet, BASIC only has LTP. https://historicdata.betfair.com/Betfai ... cation.pdf

I'm not sure why there are meetings missing.
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