Is someone cheating?

[Realrocknrolla]

Lord Derek being called out for seemingly not understanding value

Gonna get the popcorn!!!!!!!!!!!

[Derek27]

...this smart asshole would have matched the whole amount too.

You don't have to be smart to back a team at 8.0 that's gone/looks like going a goal up with a minute to go. And you shouldn't call somebody an arsehole just because they've won money off you. If you've been trading for 10 years you should have learnt to take these things in your stride and move on to the next market.

[Derek27]

But now there was a dangerous precedent when someone impudently matched the entire amount immediately knowing about the goal earlier than matchscout

That's not a precedent, that's been happening ever since in-play markets begin and the rest of us deal with it or take mitigating steps. You still haven't answered the question, do you use fill or kill? It's far better than winging about being cheated.

[Derek27]

I'm trading Republic of Ireland v France without pictures. If I get caught out you won't hear me complaining or calling anyone a cheat. It's entirely at my own risk, hence the name betting.

[numberzero]

...this smart asshole would have matched the whole amount too.

You don't have to be smart to back a team at 8.0 that's gone/looks like going a goal up with a minute to go. And you shouldn't call somebody an arsehole just because they've won money off you. If you've been trading for 10 years you should have learnt to take these things in your stride and move on to the next market.

I don’t want to answer you because you are talking bullshit. I already explained to you that the bet with a price of 8 was before the goal, was matched at the time of the goal and the market was immediately suspended after it.
I realized that you think that I should have watched the market and the match every second and not hoped for a suspension. In this case I have nothing to talk to you about. If there is no suspension in time , then the whole point of trading on the BF will be lost

[Derek27]

...this smart asshole would have matched the whole amount too.

You don't have to be smart to back a team at 8.0 that's gone/looks like going a goal up with a minute to go. And you shouldn't call somebody an arsehole just because they've won money off you. If you've been trading for 10 years you should have learnt to take these things in your stride and move on to the next market.

I don’t want to answer you because you are talking bullshit. I already explained to you that the bet with a price of 8 was before the goal, was matched at the time of the goal and the market was immediately suspended after it.
I realized that you think that I should have watched the market and the match every second and not hoped for a suspension. In this case I have nothing to talk to you about. If there is no suspension in time , then the whole point of trading on the BF will be lost

You won't answer me because you're not capable of answering simple questions. I was only asking you if you use fill or kill.

If you were capable of reading you'd realise I'm trading a match right now without watching it. If the bet was matched at the time the goal was scored then you were offering 8 as the ball crossed the line - that's value for the other guy.

If you were running a rules file like the one below it could have saved you from losing £150 or whatever you lost. It cancels all back bets when others pull their back bets, in milliseconds if your refresh rate is fast enough, but it can easily be modified for lay bets. It might have cancelled your offer at 8.0 before the other guy took your money!

[numberzero]

You won't answer me because you're not capable of answering simple questions. I was only asking you if you use fill or kill.

If you were capable of reading you'd realise I'm trading a match right now without watching it. If the bet was matched at the time the goal was scored then you were offering 8 as the ball crossed the line - that's value for the other guy.

If you were running a rules file like the one below it could have saved you from losing £150 or whatever you lost. It cancels all back bets when others pull their back bets, in milliseconds if your refresh rate is fast enough, but it can easily be modified for lay bets. It might have cancelled your offer at 8.0 before the other guy took your money!

I dont use it on these markets.
I just bet on different markets and different matches at the same time and wait for someone to buy value.When the bet is matched I get a sound alert and instantly decide how to cash out. There are big values and i dont have a problem even if i loose when someone bets fair.It happens very rarely
If there is no suspension on time, then the whole point of such trading disappears, since you can win a little bit 100 times and lose once a lot.
If they missed the market suspension by 2.5 seconds like you said they should void the bets.

[Dallas]

Betfair were considering doing away with in-play suspensions on football markets and leaving them all unmanaged once turned in-play

Many of us (me included) think it would actually work much better and produce more liquidity, tennis has no suspensions after each point, game and set is won of if there are any injury time-outs and they work perfectly fine

[Derek27]

You won't answer me because you're not capable of answering simple questions. I was only asking you if you use fill or kill.

If you were capable of reading you'd realise I'm trading a match right now without watching it. If the bet was matched at the time the goal was scored then you were offering 8 as the ball crossed the line - that's value for the other guy.

If you were running a rules file like the one below it could have saved you from losing £150 or whatever you lost. It cancels all back bets when others pull their back bets, in milliseconds if your refresh rate is fast enough, but it can easily be modified for lay bets. It might have cancelled your offer at 8.0 before the other guy took your money!

I dont use it on these markets.
I just bet on different markets and different matches at the same time and wait for someone to buy value.When the bet is matched I get a sound alert and instantly decide how to cash out. There are big values and i dont have a problem even if i loose when someone bets fair.It happens very rarely
If there is no suspension on time, then the whole point of such trading disappears, since you can win a little bit 100 times and lose once a lot.
If they missed the market suspension by 2.5 seconds like you said they should void the bets.

I said the opposite. If they miss by a few seconds I wouldn't expect them to void bets. As Donald Rumsfeld would say, you need to gear your strategy to the exchange you're using, not the exchange you'd like to use. If you're risking £150 to win a few quid you're bound to get caught out and lose a large chunk of profit on occasions.

You don't know for certain that the bet was taken after the goal was scored. The bet could have been placed in the seconds leading up to it. You're just believing what you want to believe, that you've been cheated rather than losing fair and square.

[Derek27]

Betfair were considering doing away with in-play suspensions on football markets and leaving them all unmanaged once turned in-play

Many of us (me included) think it would actually work much better and produce more liquidity, tennis has no suspensions after each point, game and set is won of if there are any injury time-outs and they work perfectly fine

I would much rather they used better quality suspend monkeys and give them proper training and better fees. But as that's not likely to happen I'd welcome scrapping the in-play suspensions.

[Dallas]

Betfair were considering doing away with in-play suspensions on football markets and leaving them all unmanaged once turned in-play

Many of us (me included) think it would actually work much better and produce more liquidity, tennis has no suspensions after each point, game and set is won of if there are any injury time-outs and they work perfectly fine

I would much rather they used better quality suspend monkeys and give them proper training and better fees. But as that's not likely to happen I'd welcome scrapping the in-play suspensions.

Just checking when it was and it was at the start of the 2019 season and was tested on a few dozen of the UK matches, not really sure what happened but knowing the speed BF work at when covid halted all football matches 7mths later that probably scuppered it and they since forgot about it

[numberzero]

I said the opposite. If they miss by a few seconds I wouldn't expect them to void bets. As Donald Rumsfeld would say, you need to gear your strategy to the exchange you're using, not the exchange you'd like to use. If you're risking £150 to win a few quid you're bound to get caught out and lose a large chunk of profit on occasions.

You don't know for certain that the bet was taken after the goal was scored. The bet could have been placed in the seconds leading up to it. You're just believing what you want to believe, that you've been cheated rather than losing fair and square.

You are right here , I do not argue. My strategy is almost win-win on paper, but in reality there are nuancees that can level out a large part of the profit
And even the rules are theoretically on my side, but they are not in practice.

[numberzero]

Just checking when it was and it was at the start of the 2019 season and was tested on a few dozen of the UK matches, not really sure what happened but knowing the speed BF work at when covid halted all football matches 7mths later that probably scuppered it and they since forgot about it

If you remember 10 years ago ,when I first started trading, there were matches in the lower English leagues without suspension. And they were illiquid even then.

[Dallas]

I said the opposite. If they miss by a few seconds I wouldn't expect them to void bets. As Donald Rumsfeld would say, you need to gear your strategy to the exchange you're using, not the exchange you'd like to use. If you're risking £150 to win a few quid you're bound to get caught out and lose a large chunk of profit on occasions.

You don't know for certain that the bet was taken after the goal was scored. The bet could have been placed in the seconds leading up to it. You're just believing what you want to believe, that you've been cheated rather than losing fair and square.

You are right here , I do not argue. My strategy is almost win-win on paper, but in reality there are nuancees that can level out a large part of the profit
And even the rules are theoretically on my side, but they are not in practice.

TBF most strategies are win-win on paper and in PM, but in real markets when others can see and react to your bets plus other factors its a different story - hence why you should never waste time testing a strategy in PM, back fitting it to data or paper trading etc.

Instead always test it a in a live market with actual money

[numberzero]

Without a suspension of the market, 98% of the players will lose money and the fastest 2% will win constantly. BF will never do this