Tiger Woods

[The Silk Run]

...ten people talking to each other means one thing.....f*****

With my first guess I'm going to say.. FAMILY?

How about a clue or an extra letter?

Consonant please Carol

Loox like I have upset Morbid. I new I should have gone to church, or trainspotting

[Trader Pat]

...ten people talking to each other means one thing.....f*****

With my first guess I'm going to say.. FAMILY?

How about a clue or an extra letter?

Consonant please Carol

Loox like I have upset Morbid. I new I should have gone to church, or trainspotting

Yes shame on you!

[greenmark]

It always gets me how this man and Jack Nicklaus can even be mentioned in the same sentence. The only time this should ever happen is for golf achievements but that's where it ends. My opinion of Tiger Woods wasn't affected by this incident, it was cemented long ago and once again it staggers me how anyone could ever defend this man.

In Jack Nicklaus' day people and society generally had higher standards.

In today's post-Christian western world anything goes and the results shouldn't come as a surprise.

It's unfair to judge Tiger by the moral standards of another era. I don't think anything he did is particularly shocking today.

I wasn't judging him by the moral standards of another era and its equally unfair to let him off the hook even slightly simply because people in previous generations had as you rightly say higher standards generally. Let me give a different if not better example then. He comes a long way short of the moral values practiced by many sportsman within his own profession in the modern world let alone in all other sports. There are tens of millions of men all over the world who are good husbands and fathers and role models despite society differences. I think we can all very much agree on that.

The phrase "particularly shocking" is vague because what one person defines as shocking, another doesn't. But as I said, if you were the father of his ex then would you dismiss his numerous infidelities and drug taking when your daughters and grandaughters health and life are at risk from this man and that's before he even gets behind the wheel. Heaven knows what else his exes could divulge if they dared to speak or could even speak legally.

Do I respect him for his achievements? How could you not respect his tenacity to get to be the best. To attack his own weaknesses so that he had none and dominate a highly competitive sport and winning the 2008 US Open with an injury. His golf CV is immense and cannot be argued against. But as a human, he has the CV of scum until he proves otherwise. His lifestyle is a health hazard to anyone who gets close to him. Chronic infidelity coupled with drug taking leads down some very dark and serious roads and no father worth his salt would ever want that for his own daughter. This is before we even go down the road of saying how much responsibility this man carries as a role model to young kids who would want to emulate him and look up to him and he has failed just as miserably in that as he has succeeded in golf

TBH I think you should cut Tiger (and people like him) some slack. You aren't insulated from issues like infidelity or substance abuse., just because you're rich and famous. Infidelity-wise, come on! He's had women throwing themselves at him for decades. Yes, it is IMO reprehensible to cheat on your life partner. But its hardly unusual. Substance abuse? Well, yes that indicates a deeper problem. Knowing someone in the alcohol counselling arena informs me that the issue is far from simple. Generally, there are other factors other than just being a slob or having a lack of willpower. The addiction is just a symptom/outlet for other deep-seated emotional issues. And being rich/famous is no antidote to that.

[Trader Pat]

In Jack Nicklaus' day people and society generally had higher standards.

In today's post-Christian western world anything goes and the results shouldn't come as a surprise.

It's unfair to judge Tiger by the moral standards of another era. I don't think anything he did is particularly shocking today.

I wasn't judging him by the moral standards of another era and its equally unfair to let him off the hook even slightly simply because people in previous generations had as you rightly say higher standards generally. Let me give a different if not better example then. He comes a long way short of the moral values practiced by many sportsman within his own profession in the modern world let alone in all other sports. There are tens of millions of men all over the world who are good husbands and fathers and role models despite society differences. I think we can all very much agree on that.

The phrase "particularly shocking" is vague because what one person defines as shocking, another doesn't. But as I said, if you were the father of his ex then would you dismiss his numerous infidelities and drug taking when your daughters and grandaughters health and life are at risk from this man and that's before he even gets behind the wheel. Heaven knows what else his exes could divulge if they dared to speak or could even speak legally.

Do I respect him for his achievements? How could you not respect his tenacity to get to be the best. To attack his own weaknesses so that he had none and dominate a highly competitive sport and winning the 2008 US Open with an injury. His golf CV is immense and cannot be argued against. But as a human, he has the CV of scum until he proves otherwise. His lifestyle is a health hazard to anyone who gets close to him. Chronic infidelity coupled with drug taking leads down some very dark and serious roads and no father worth his salt would ever want that for his own daughter. This is before we even go down the road of saying how much responsibility this man carries as a role model to young kids who would want to emulate him and look up to him and he has failed just as miserably in that as he has succeeded in golf

TBH I think you should cut Tiger (and people like him) some slack. You aren't insulated from issues like infidelity or substance abuse., just because you're rich and famous. Infidelity-wise, come on! He's had women throwing themselves at him for decades. Yes, it is IMO reprehensible to cheat on your life partner. But its hardly unusual. Substance abuse? Well, yes that indicates a deeper problem. Knowing someone in the alcohol counselling arena informs me that the issue is far from simple. Generally, there are other factors other than just being a slob or having a lack of willpower. The addiction is just a symptom/outlet for other deep-seated emotional issues. And being rich/famous is no antidote to that.

I don't think smoking the odd joint can be classed as substance abuse and getting addicted to strong pain medication could happen to pretty much anybody especially in the States where doctors seem to prescribe the strong stuff for stubbed toes, Tiger had a lot of surgeries so can only imagine the type of pain meds he was on.

Calling a person scum for that and sleeping around is way way OTT, the scum tag should be saved for rapists, paedophiles and drug dealers. I don't have kids but I sort of understand the point about nobody would want it to happen to their daughter but a simple fact of life is that most men sleep around if given the opportunity. And as Green said Tiger would have had lots or opportunities!

[greenmark]

I wasn't judging him by the moral standards of another era and its equally unfair to let him off the hook even slightly simply because people in previous generations had as you rightly say higher standards generally. Let me give a different if not better example then. He comes a long way short of the moral values practiced by many sportsman within his own profession in the modern world let alone in all other sports. There are tens of millions of men all over the world who are good husbands and fathers and role models despite society differences. I think we can all very much agree on that.

The phrase "particularly shocking" is vague because what one person defines as shocking, another doesn't. But as I said, if you were the father of his ex then would you dismiss his numerous infidelities and drug taking when your daughters and grandaughters health and life are at risk from this man and that's before he even gets behind the wheel. Heaven knows what else his exes could divulge if they dared to speak or could even speak legally.

Do I respect him for his achievements? How could you not respect his tenacity to get to be the best. To attack his own weaknesses so that he had none and dominate a highly competitive sport and winning the 2008 US Open with an injury. His golf CV is immense and cannot be argued against. But as a human, he has the CV of scum until he proves otherwise. His lifestyle is a health hazard to anyone who gets close to him. Chronic infidelity coupled with drug taking leads down some very dark and serious roads and no father worth his salt would ever want that for his own daughter. This is before we even go down the road of saying how much responsibility this man carries as a role model to young kids who would want to emulate him and look up to him and he has failed just as miserably in that as he has succeeded in golf

TBH I think you should cut Tiger (and people like him) some slack. You aren't insulated from issues like infidelity or substance abuse., just because you're rich and famous. Infidelity-wise, come on! He's had women throwing themselves at him for decades. Yes, it is IMO reprehensible to cheat on your life partner. But its hardly unusual. Substance abuse? Well, yes that indicates a deeper problem. Knowing someone in the alcohol counselling arena informs me that the issue is far from simple. Generally, there are other factors other than just being a slob or having a lack of willpower. The addiction is just a symptom/outlet for other deep-seated emotional issues. And being rich/famous is no antidote to that.

I don't think smoking the odd joint can be classed as substance abuse and getting addicted to strong pain medication could happen to pretty much anybody especially in the States where doctors seem to prescribe the strong stuff for stubbed toes, Tiger had a lot of surgeries so can only imagine the type of pain meds he was on.

"most men sleep around if given the opportunity" I find that a bleak outlook. None of my friends/relatives have gone down that route, except as a transition from one relationship to another. As a good friend of mine said 'you don't know who you are going to meet or how it will affect you, these things just happen, we're only human'. But I have worked with/met people who have a reputation for seeking out liaisons despite being in a marriage with children.
And TBH I didn't like any of them.

[Trader Pat]

"most men sleep around if given the opportunity" I find that a bleak outlook.

Bleak yes but true

None of my friends/relatives have gone down that route

How do you know? It's not something most men would boast about.

But I have worked with/met people who have a reputation for seeking out liaisons despite being in a marriage with children.
And TBH I didn't like any of them.

You don't have to be seeking it out for it to happen though.


I'm 42, single and I've only had 2 serious relationships in my life and I didn't cheat in either of them. Love had nothing to do with that though it was respect. I suppose it depends a lot on what type of relationship you have. I'm no Dr Ruth but I suppose if its built on respect and love rather than just love then you're less likely to stray.

Having said all that I have been known to talk bollocks!

[The Silk Run]

I think your skills are transferable Some GOOD content from you, and greenmark.

[Derek27]

The covid and US election thread has dropped off the front page. I bet Peter regrets starting this topic now.

TBH I think you should cut Tiger (and people like him) some slack. You aren't insulated from issues like infidelity or substance abuse., just because you're rich and famous. Infidelity-wise, come on! He's had women throwing themselves at him for decades. Yes, it is IMO reprehensible to cheat on your life partner. But its hardly unusual. Substance abuse? Well, yes that indicates a deeper problem. Knowing someone in the alcohol counselling arena informs me that the issue is far from simple. Generally, there are other factors other than just being a slob or having a lack of willpower. The addiction is just a symptom/outlet for other deep-seated emotional issues. And being rich/famous is no antidote to that.

That's a fair point. I've never been unfaithful but in the time I've spent with the few girlfriends that I've had, I never encountered the opportunity.

[Trader Pat]

The covid and US election thread has dropped off the front page. I bet Peter regrets starting this topic now.

The forum at its best!

[Trader Pat]

I think your skills are transferable Some GOOD content from you, and greenmark.

Honesty is always the best policy

[Crazyskier]

It always gets me how this man and Jack Nicklaus can even be mentioned in the same sentence. The only time this should ever happen is for golf achievements but that's where it ends. My opinion of Tiger Woods wasn't affected by this incident, it was cemented long ago and once again it staggers me how anyone could ever defend this man.

In Jack Nicklaus' day people and society generally had higher standards.

In today's post-Christian western world anything goes and the results shouldn't come as a surprise.

It's unfair to judge Tiger by the moral standards of another era. I don't think anything he did is particularly shocking today.

What a load of bollocks! The West may have become multi-cultural in recent decades, for better or worse, but it is still working upon Christian laws, values and holidays, even if those actually attending church is in decline. The Queen remains the head of the Church of England.

Almost everyone I know is at least nominally Christian, or has at least some belief in a 'supreme being' and the vow of HOLY MATRIMONY is hardly 'of another era' is it?

Adultery is just as sinful today as it ever was. It's an absolute betrayal of one's spouse, and always will be. To even suggest otherwise is to indulge in self-deception of the worst kind.

How can you even begin to condone Tiger Wood's behaviour, on any level? To suggest that morality somehow belongs in 'another era' is frankly, absurd, and actually indicative of the selfish me, me, me mentality that is causing so much damage to wider Western society. God help us if you and others genuinely have that attitude, Superfrank. I'm both shocked and disappointed.

CS

[Derek27]

What a load of bollocks! The West may have become multi-cultural in recent decades, for better or worse, but it is still working upon Christian laws, values and holidays, even if those actually attending church is in decline.

Infidelity is not against the law so you can't say the west is working upon Christian laws.

Almost everyone I know is at least nominally Christian, and the vow of HOLY MATRIMONY is hardly 'of another era' is it?

That's because you're Christian. Most people I know are nominally atheist.

Infidelity is just as sinful today as it ever was.

I googled the word sin: an immoral act considered to be a transgression against divine law.

On that definition, it's only 'considered' to be wrong, and only against divine law, which nobody is obliged to obey.

[Trader Pat]

How can you even begin to condone Tiger Wood's behaviour, on any level? To suggest that morality somehow belongs in 'another era' is frankly, absurd, and actually indicative of the selfish me, me, me mentality that is causing so much damage to wider Western society. God help us if you and others genuinely have that attitude, Superfrank. I'm both shocked and disappointed.

CS

I don't think anyone is condoning his behaviour but why is he being singled out? My own opinion is he's been down more than once and its always easier to kick a man when he's down. He's not the only elite sportsman who's cheated on his wife.

Morality doesn't belong in another era but immorality was much harder to detect before 24 hours news and social media.

[superfrank]

What a load of bollocks! The West may have become multi-cultural in recent decades, for better or worse, but it is still working upon Christian laws, values and holidays, even if those actually attending church is in decline. The Queen remains the head of the Church of England.

How many children go to Sunday school these days or sing hymns in the school assembly? 1 in 10 at a push.

When he becomes King, the Prince of Wales is likely to become 'Defender of Faith' rather than 'Defender of The Faith' and the charlatan currently holding the office of Archbishop of Canterbury has admitted to doubts about the existence of God!

I'm a Christian, and I'm not condoning Tiger's behaviour, but society is very different to what it was 50 years ago and it's increasingly less Christian and less moral. Not good imho, but we are where we are.

[greenmark]

What a load of bollocks! The West may have become multi-cultural in recent decades, for better or worse, but it is still working upon Christian laws, values and holidays, even if those actually attending church is in decline. The Queen remains the head of the Church of England.

How many children go to Sunday school these days or sing hymns in the school assembly? 1 in 10 at a push.

When he becomes King, the Prince of Wales is likely to become 'Defender of Faith' rather than 'Defender of The Faith' and the charlatan currently holding the office of Archbishop of Canterbury has admitted to doubts about the existence of God!

I'm a Christian, and I'm not condoning Tiger's behaviour, but society is very different to what it was 50 years ago and it's increasingly less Christian and less moral. Not good imho, but we are where we are.

What about people like me?. I see a lot of merit in religious teachings. They are remarkably similar. Tolerance, charity, selflessness.
But I'm agnostic.
I just think Tiger is human. Money and fame means nothing. Sure, he's rich therefore he should behave and/or get help if he can't. But emotions are really not that simple. To me the guy may be be in another turmoil. I don't understand how someone so excellent in one sphere of life can be so rubbish outside of that sphere.
Are we looking at the 2020's version of Elvis?