Ukraine Crisis

[jamesg46]

The conspiracy theory isn't the existence of the Azov battalllion, that was covered way back in the thread. The CT is that the existence of a Neo Nazi faction in the Ukrainian military is the part of the reason for the invasion. Putin has used that and the possibility of Ukraine joining NATO as a pretext for the invasion. It's just a good old fashioned land grab pure and simple.

So a conspiracy theory is to repeat stipulated demands or reasons given? Not sure that’s how conspiracies work Pat. I thought a conspiracy was a secret plan to do something unlawful or harmful.

The reasons can be denied, debated, criticised or whatever but it’s not a conspiracy.

[Trader Pat]

The conspiracy theory isn't the existence of the Azov battalllion, that was covered way back in the thread. The CT is that the existence of a Neo Nazi faction in the Ukrainian military is the part of the reason for the invasion. Putin has used that and the possibility of Ukraine joining NATO as a pretext for the invasion. It's just a good old fashioned land grab pure and simple.

That should have read... The CT is the idea that the Azov battalion are roaming the countryside murdering Russian civilians.... Putin is using their existence as a pretext for the invasion etc..etc...

[napshnap]

The conspiracy theory isn't the existence of the Azov battalllion, that was covered way back in the thread. The CT is that the existence of a Neo Nazi faction in the Ukrainian military is the part of the reason for the invasion. Putin has used that and the possibility of Ukraine joining NATO as a pretext for the invasion. It's just a good old fashioned land grab pure and simple.

So a conspiracy theory is to repeat stipulated demands or reasons given? Not sure that’s how conspiracies work Pat. I thought a conspiracy was a secret plan to do something unlawful or harmful.

The reasons can be denied, debated, criticised or whatever but it’s not a conspiracy.

Stop with your sabotaging heresy, agents James and Alex! Russia is "baaaaaaaad" and the opponents is "goooooood". Everything that doesn't fit this strong as steel narrative is a CT!

But seriously, consider me a conspiracy theorist, but we will never know the true causes of this conflict.

[jamesg46]

It wouldn't be much of a forum without differing views so I've no problem with that. But when reasoned debate gives way to the same old conspiracy theories again and again it's time to move on.

What Alex said isn’t a conspiracy theory, it’s well documented. I posted a wiki link in response to Derek, it’s documented on Wiki…

Incoming wiki isn’t a credible source.

Not sure about its credibility but they allow openly racist articles to exist:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rashism

"Rushism, a word to describe Russian Nazism."

Why don't we hear "germanizm" or "japanizm" then, where're these articles?!
It's like nazism is immanent and natural for Russian people, the people who hammered Nazism back down the throat of the aggressor on the ruins of the Reichstag! I can't think of more racistic statement! That is a modern progressive politcorrect West, ladies and gentlemen.

I can’t believe we’re at a moment in time where people show support for the funding and armouring of far right Nazis & basically ignore the existence because they believe they’re fighting on the right side of the conflict.

[alexmr2]

I can’t believe we’re at a moment in time where people show support for the funding and armouring of far right Nazis & basically ignore the existence because they believe they’re fighting on the right side of the conflict.

Who'd have thunk it that the same war propaganda methods would still work on most people almost 100 years later.

We have came a long way with technology but humans never seem to evolve emotionally. Almost everyone can accept that they personally know liars and that liars exist but cannot accept that someone powerful would lie if they are in the media. If anyone questions the biased and flawed narrative then they are the bad person and it's only a conspiracy theory

[Derek27]

But seriously, consider me a conspiracy theorist, but we will never know the true causes of this conflict.

The true cause of the conflict is simple, Putin invaded Ukraine without any provocation or threat, with the pre-text that Ukraine is a danger. Now he's claiming that NATO is planning to invade Russian soil.

We will never know whether he's knowingly lying or suffering from severe mental delusions. See the link I posted about lying.

[napshnap]

I can’t believe we’re at a moment in time where people show support for the funding and armouring of far right Nazis & basically ignore the existence because they believe they’re fighting on the right side of the conflict.

Who'd have thunk it that the same war propaganda methods would still work on most people almost 100 years later.

We have came a long way with technology but humans never seem to evolve emotionally. Almost everyone can accept that they personally know liars and that liars exist but cannot accept that someone powerful would lie if they are in the media. If anyone questions the biased and flawed narrative then they are the bad person and it's only a conspiracy theory

Russian novelist Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn who survived many horrors of totalitarianism was astonished at how western people are meek and trusting of the state.

[Derek27]

I can’t believe we’re at a moment in time where people show support for the funding and armouring of far right Nazis & basically ignore the existence because they believe they’re fighting on the right side of the conflict.

Who'd have thunk it that the same war propaganda methods would still work on most people almost 100 years later.

We have came a long way with technology but humans never seem to evolve emotionally. Almost everyone can accept that they personally know liars and that liars exist but cannot accept that someone powerful would lie if they are in the media. If anyone questions the biased and flawed narrative then they are the bad person and it's only a conspiracy theory

Russian novelist Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn who survived many horrors of totalitarianism was astonished was amazed at how western people are meek and trusting of the state
.

We're led by the biggest liar on the planet. Keir Starmer calls him a liar and untrustworthy to his face at prime minister question time every week. So do dozens of MPs even from his own party. I bang on about what a liar he is. I can assure you nobody here trusts the state, we decide what we believe to be the truth.

[Trader Pat]

I can’t believe we’re at a moment in time where people show support for the funding and armouring of far right Nazis & basically ignore the existence because they believe they’re fighting on the right side of the conflict.

Who'd have thunk it that the same war propaganda methods would still work on most people almost 100 years later.

We have came a long way with technology but humans never seem to evolve emotionally. Almost everyone can accept that they personally know liars and that liars exist but cannot accept that someone powerful would lie if they are in the media. If anyone questions the biased and flawed narrative then they are the bad person and it's only a conspiracy theory

Russian novelist Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn who survived many horrors of totalitarianism was astonished at how western people are meek and trusting of the state.

Lots of biases on show in this thread..

Just because people have different points of view doesn't mean they believe everything the media or politicians say.

[Derek27]

Starmer seemed quite emotional in that speech.

[napshnap]

Who'd have thunk it that the same war propaganda methods would still work on most people almost 100 years later.

We have came a long way with technology but humans never seem to evolve emotionally. Almost everyone can accept that they personally know liars and that liars exist but cannot accept that someone powerful would lie if they are in the media. If anyone questions the biased and flawed narrative then they are the bad person and it's only a conspiracy theory

Russian novelist Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn who survived many horrors of totalitarianism was astonished was amazed at how western people are meek and trusting of the state
.

We're led by the biggest liar on the planet. Keir Starmer calls him a liar and untrustworthy to his face at prime minister question time every week. So do dozens of MPs even from his own party. I bang on about what a liar he is. I can assure you nobody here trusts the state, we decide what we believe to be the truth.

I don't believe you, Derek. I don't want to believe that when they send these damn tons of death - they express your true will, I don't want to believe that you're still in control of them and that the same time you sincerely want this cannibalism to continue. I think that you, the people of the West, the civil society, lost control of the state and big corps and that is a tradegy for me because if little we (people) can do "here" and no much more can do you "there" then we are all doomed. Sorry for my dark mood.

[Derek27]

Putin said the invasion of Ukraine was necessary - so he's finally admitted he's invaded.

[Archery1969]

Ukraine now in possession of 85 of the 90 howitzer's the US promised. And I wouldn't want to be on the receiving end of one of them.

[goat68]

I knew this world should never have been trusted with the "Internet"...
We hear too much, say too much, believe too much, know too much,...
Bring on a quiet rural idle in the 17th century, anyone got a time machine handy?

[Derek27]

I knew this world should never have been trusted with the "Internet"...
We hear too much, say too much, believe too much, know too much,...
Bring on a quiet rural idle in the 17th century, anyone got a time machine handy?

When the internet was born, non-technical people who never used a computer didn't understand that anyone can attach a website to the internet and say what they like. If you remember, it was branded as the information superhighway, nothing was said about the accuracy of the information.

But 25 years on, I think people are generally aware of what's on it. Only the CT nutters believe all the crap, because that's what they want to believe.