Dallas wrote:From that video to me its looked exactly like a bot with no delay reacting to money in and out of the market.
Same here, looks like cross matching at work. Cross matching isn't subject to any delay so as soon as the bet hits their server it's available to be used as a virtual bet and displayed on the site.
spreadbetting wrote:Same here, looks like cross matching at work. Cross matching isn't subject to any delay so as soon as the bet hits their server it's available to be used as a virtual bet and displayed on the site.
I dont think its cross matching at play just a BF bot with no delay trying to kick start a illiquid market after a suspension and is removed when real money is placed.
steven1976 wrote:Thanks. Someone told me previous they went through your servers but I didn't believe it considering the speed I see the number on my screen.
We are not allowed by Betfair to do that. Once we log in you in that's it, everything that happens is between you and Betfair.
I've done a video for you on what I think you are seeing. But I think we really need Betfair to clarify a number of things, because it's soooooo confusing.
That's an excellent video mate. It also shows perfectly that sometimes when we think we are seeing a bot, it is in fact BF XM
I hate it personally, I think it wreaks havoc with the integrity of the markets. We all know why BF do it, and it's got bugger all with offering us a better service
Just watched the video, if you put money in a horse race hours from start it happens all the time, i thought it was traders bots reacting to weight of money.
Good demo video Peter, but what I don't understand is when you keep saying something along the lines of "does that money exist there or does it not" or "if you take a price then it was never there, and then disappears" or referring to them as 'phantom bets'.
Surely the purpose of cross-matching is to display an "alternate view" of available money. In what situation would cross-matching display money on the ladder that ISN'T available to match? Surely if the money is displayed there then you should be able to match against it, whether it directly be money on offer or whether cross-matching will match you against another runner.
If you CAN'T match against money being displayed (virtual or not) then I definitely think something is not right.
Side note: Surely that money at 2.86 at the start of the video was NOT due to cross-matching. It gets affected by your bets initially, but then disappears for good later. i.e. it doesn't seem to have deterministic behaviour and therefore must be more complex than cross-matching.
The big problem is that Betfair haven't exactly explained how it is matched. So I can't really answer the question. Which gets matched first, how and how does that affect the unmatched portion on the other side? What is the queue position?
I referred to them as Phantom bets because so many times I've gone to take a price, only not to be matched. Fill rate has fallen since the introduction of XM so I don't believe it has been beneficial at all. Where has that money gone, or is it just a case of XM over-inflating reported matched volume figures?
I don't think we really have enough explanations to be confident that we know fully what is happening?
Thanks for posting, its a good clear video showing cross matching in action.
I ve wacthed very closely looking for every slight change, I could see In your video there was barely a change to the colum you where actually placing the bets in - when laying the first few lays caused £3 to dissapear off £212 @ 1.54 odds after a while £2 of the £39 @ 1.56 moved upto the 1.57 price you where laying at and after that each time you placed the lay there where no changes anywhere on that lay colum.
When you backed on the right selection there was never any changes to any of the bets in that colum
In steven1976's video his few bets totalling about £10-£12 some how controlled 3 other bets worth a few hundred quid all in the same colum (its just a shame his video did nt catch the other selection aswell).
