Lol,
cluck
Trading Anger Management
Just a few random suggestions:
Meditation
Self-hypnosis (You can probably find some decent recordings on YouTube. Failing that, I'd recommend the recordings that come on the DVDs accompanying Paul McKenna's books)
Getting a punch bag
Visualising yourself being calm in a frustrating trading situation and staying relaxed and focused (sportspeople use this kind of technique to keep focused in the face of distractions like unsporting behaviour from their opponents).
Morning Pages (a trading book I read basically said 'don't bother trading unless you can do this exercise every day') - see http://www.highlysensitivesouls.com/art ... gpages.htm
Positive self-talk - Try to say something positive about that 5 tick loss! For example, 'I bet next time the spike will go in my favour!', or 'This is a great opportunity for me to practice staying calm and focused in the face of provocation from the trading gods!'.
Telling yourself a good joke or imagining a funny scene from a movie when something annoying happens.
Playing calming or inspiring music whilst you're trading.
Simply refocusing on the task in hand when something frustrating happens. I would say that what makes people frustrated is not an event itself, but our thoughts about it. Change your thoughts and you change your life.
I hope this helps.
Jeff
Meditation
Self-hypnosis (You can probably find some decent recordings on YouTube. Failing that, I'd recommend the recordings that come on the DVDs accompanying Paul McKenna's books)
Getting a punch bag
Visualising yourself being calm in a frustrating trading situation and staying relaxed and focused (sportspeople use this kind of technique to keep focused in the face of distractions like unsporting behaviour from their opponents).
Morning Pages (a trading book I read basically said 'don't bother trading unless you can do this exercise every day') - see http://www.highlysensitivesouls.com/art ... gpages.htm
Positive self-talk - Try to say something positive about that 5 tick loss! For example, 'I bet next time the spike will go in my favour!', or 'This is a great opportunity for me to practice staying calm and focused in the face of provocation from the trading gods!'.
Telling yourself a good joke or imagining a funny scene from a movie when something annoying happens.
Playing calming or inspiring music whilst you're trading.
Simply refocusing on the task in hand when something frustrating happens. I would say that what makes people frustrated is not an event itself, but our thoughts about it. Change your thoughts and you change your life.
I hope this helps.
Jeff
rhysmr2 wrote:Does anyone have any advice on this subject?
Hi Oddstrader
I think that having confidence in your ability to recover from any losses is important.
With my gambling, I can go down £300 without worrying too much, as I know that my edge means that I'll eventually make it back. So I'll just plug away, using methods that have worked over thousands of bets and are unlikely to suddenly stop working...
If you're confident that you have a long-term edge (and let's face it, anyone who's able to trade professionally does), then losses are nothing to worry about. They are just an unavoidable business expense. I should add that I'm not there yet with my trading, but I'd like to think that I'm getting there. At the moment, all I'm looking for is progress, not perfection!
Jeff
I think that having confidence in your ability to recover from any losses is important.
With my gambling, I can go down £300 without worrying too much, as I know that my edge means that I'll eventually make it back. So I'll just plug away, using methods that have worked over thousands of bets and are unlikely to suddenly stop working...
If you're confident that you have a long-term edge (and let's face it, anyone who's able to trade professionally does), then losses are nothing to worry about. They are just an unavoidable business expense. I should add that I'm not there yet with my trading, but I'd like to think that I'm getting there. At the moment, all I'm looking for is progress, not perfection!
Jeff
oddstrader wrote:I think most of us have gone through similar experiences, the way i look at it now is this : £100 loss after 2 or 3 races is annoying but i can recover from the loss in another 2 or 3 races whereas if i trade recklessly it could and most likely would cost a hell of lot more than £100 - i can recover from a few bad races easily but a bank blow up could take weeks! and there is something very satisfying about recovering from a bad start you feel better to have worked your way back rather than gambled the lot in hope.
Interesting, some great ideas thanks,
JollyGreen, I don't warm down, I'll try that thanks, my diet is very good though, post workout is a protein shake but then I have a balanced meal soon after,(low GI complex carbs, lean protein and fibrous carbs) no simple carbs ever. Only caffein I get is from green tea.
Sweetybt, I don't eat many eggs really, I do have a high protein diet though.
Predition, I have always thought weights should help but my anger is worse after weights without doubt, only when trading though, strange I know! I notice my anger is even worse when I use creatine. I don't use roids or anything.
Ferru, some good suggestions thanks.
JollyGreen, I don't warm down, I'll try that thanks, my diet is very good though, post workout is a protein shake but then I have a balanced meal soon after,(low GI complex carbs, lean protein and fibrous carbs) no simple carbs ever. Only caffein I get is from green tea.
Sweetybt, I don't eat many eggs really, I do have a high protein diet though.
Predition, I have always thought weights should help but my anger is worse after weights without doubt, only when trading though, strange I know! I notice my anger is even worse when I use creatine. I don't use roids or anything.
Ferru, some good suggestions thanks.
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oddstrader
- Posts: 344
- Joined: Fri Apr 16, 2010 4:55 pm
I certainly would benefit from some advice on nutrition jollygreen if you are offering,PleaseJollyGreen wrote:Hi Rhys
If you need proof, try trading when you are unwell or badly hungover - it is a nightmare!
Let me know if you want advice on easy nutrition I am more than happy to help.
Hi Rhys,
I can really relate to what you say, i have terrible anger problems when trading! Its hard to explain why,but trading can be so frustrating at times, especially when the market decides to do something that you dont want it to!
On tuesday I completely lost it. I was banging my desk, screaming, shouting, stamping, smashing my sky remote. Then i did something really stupid, i kicked some weights that I had lying on the floor, only wearing my slippers I thought I had broken my foot!
I was so embarassed, particularly as the
losses were not really that significant in the run of things, in fact they were put right the next day! I would have felt so stupid going to hospital with a broken foot just because a trade went against me!! Luckily I woke up the next day and it was only bruised.
Im not sure about a solution, ideally id like to sit there all calm, but that is much easier to do when things are going smoothly. I find that when I work out it makes me worst. I thought being fit would help me,but it just gets my blood pumping and makes me very temperamental.I feel like the incredible hulk tying to trade! Telling the market not to make me angry, you wont like me when im angry!
Whats the saying? Show me a good loser and i'll show you a loser?!! In my case its show me someone who is losing and i'll show you how to smash a desk up!Once the day is over i feel fine too, it can just build up sometimes and then i let it out in an explosion of rage against whatever i can get my hands on!
This isnt going to be the best advice you will ever read on a trading forum, but i find the best way for me is to get really stoned before I trade! I have never lost my temper this way, and find it much easier to adapt that over cautious careful approach that often pays dividends!! On the downside I get really hungry, and come out of the day as if I have been walking around a magical mystical world of numbers, graphs, green and red, but mainly green, lovely green!!
Though i suppose meditation, deep breathing, and a healthy diet would help much better! And win, always helps if you can win!!
Good luck.
I can really relate to what you say, i have terrible anger problems when trading! Its hard to explain why,but trading can be so frustrating at times, especially when the market decides to do something that you dont want it to!
On tuesday I completely lost it. I was banging my desk, screaming, shouting, stamping, smashing my sky remote. Then i did something really stupid, i kicked some weights that I had lying on the floor, only wearing my slippers I thought I had broken my foot!
I was so embarassed, particularly as the
losses were not really that significant in the run of things, in fact they were put right the next day! I would have felt so stupid going to hospital with a broken foot just because a trade went against me!! Luckily I woke up the next day and it was only bruised.
Im not sure about a solution, ideally id like to sit there all calm, but that is much easier to do when things are going smoothly. I find that when I work out it makes me worst. I thought being fit would help me,but it just gets my blood pumping and makes me very temperamental.I feel like the incredible hulk tying to trade! Telling the market not to make me angry, you wont like me when im angry!
Whats the saying? Show me a good loser and i'll show you a loser?!! In my case its show me someone who is losing and i'll show you how to smash a desk up!Once the day is over i feel fine too, it can just build up sometimes and then i let it out in an explosion of rage against whatever i can get my hands on!
This isnt going to be the best advice you will ever read on a trading forum, but i find the best way for me is to get really stoned before I trade! I have never lost my temper this way, and find it much easier to adapt that over cautious careful approach that often pays dividends!! On the downside I get really hungry, and come out of the day as if I have been walking around a magical mystical world of numbers, graphs, green and red, but mainly green, lovely green!!
Though i suppose meditation, deep breathing, and a healthy diet would help much better! And win, always helps if you can win!!
Good luck.
Hi Oscar123
Have you considered that, when you get stoned, what relaxes you is in fact not the pot but the fact that you are breathing deeply?
So why not try breathing deeply on its own and see if that works?
Alternatively, why not try listening to a recording like this? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jmNrz6SlBqI
Jeff
Have you considered that, when you get stoned, what relaxes you is in fact not the pot but the fact that you are breathing deeply?
So why not try breathing deeply on its own and see if that works?
Alternatively, why not try listening to a recording like this? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jmNrz6SlBqI
Jeff
oscar123 wrote: This isnt going to be the best advice you will ever read on a trading forum, but i find the best way for me is to get really stoned before I trade!
Hi Ferru123,
To be honest I dont breathe more deeply when, stoned, my breathing becomes more shallow, and in truth im not even more relaxed.
It was only really a tongue in cheek suggestion, and I am in no way advocating the use of banned substances when trading!
I was just saying that I have never,ever, got angry, smashed anything, even swore when encountering a loss when stoned! Its just not possible! And personally that can help me. It keeps me on an even keel, and i will almost always carry on tradfing and turn things around in a calm manner.
But I agree with you. Breathing exercises, relaxing the mind, turning your thoughts inwards,yoga, tai chi etc etc is definitely the way to go.
To be honest I dont breathe more deeply when, stoned, my breathing becomes more shallow, and in truth im not even more relaxed.
It was only really a tongue in cheek suggestion, and I am in no way advocating the use of banned substances when trading!
I was just saying that I have never,ever, got angry, smashed anything, even swore when encountering a loss when stoned! Its just not possible! And personally that can help me. It keeps me on an even keel, and i will almost always carry on tradfing and turn things around in a calm manner.
But I agree with you. Breathing exercises, relaxing the mind, turning your thoughts inwards,yoga, tai chi etc etc is definitely the way to go.
That then begs the question as to why you get angry at all, when you have such fantastic techniques at your disposal.
For years, I've known about techniques like meditation and hypnosis, but I've barely scratched at the surface of their potential. This may be because they involve work, and the mind seeks the path of least resistance. Also, I read in a meditation book that there's a part of the mind that likes to be constantly thinking, and it's hard to switch it off! So I think the key is to force yourself to meditate, whether you want to or not.
Jeff
For years, I've known about techniques like meditation and hypnosis, but I've barely scratched at the surface of their potential. This may be because they involve work, and the mind seeks the path of least resistance. Also, I read in a meditation book that there's a part of the mind that likes to be constantly thinking, and it's hard to switch it off! So I think the key is to force yourself to meditate, whether you want to or not.
Jeff
oscar123 wrote: But I agree with you. Breathing exercises, relaxing the mind, turning your thoughts inwards,yoga, tai chi etc etc is definitely the way to go.
Oscar, you've given me a good laugh to start the day
Everyone is trying to give Rhys practical help, and you suggest Cannabis!
IMO any substance, primarily drugs or alcohol, is disastrous for the serious trader. They may take away your anger, but they also take away your inhibitions. Having no perception of potential losses is catastrophic for a full-time trader
Everyone is trying to give Rhys practical help, and you suggest Cannabis!
IMO any substance, primarily drugs or alcohol, is disastrous for the serious trader. They may take away your anger, but they also take away your inhibitions. Having no perception of potential losses is catastrophic for a full-time trader
There doesn't seem to be anything wrong with your diet, R. I can't imagine creatine having an adverse effect since it's only an "energy storage capability enhancer", I do six-week courses of it from time to time, myself.rhysmr2 wrote:Predition, I have always thought weights should help but my anger is worse after weights without doubt, only when trading though, strange I know! I notice my anger is even worse when I use creatine. I don't use roids or anything.
Maybe relaxation and meditation techniques are the answer. They don't have to be weird, any simple repetitive task will do, as long as it doesn't require a lot of brain activity or concentration, for instance I get great pleasure and calmness out of filing blocks of oak smooth prior to carving, but remain jumpy whilst practising card counting.
Good luck, P
Hi Prediction
Meditation doesn't have to require much brain activity to be effective. However, brain activity doesn't hinder meditation IMHO, as long as the mind remains focused on the task in hand. And you might find that you benefit from something more mentally stimulating than going 'Ommmm'! You could try thought labeling meditation, for example: http://www.ehow.com/how_4846132_meditat ... ughts.html.
But it does require concentration - the more, the better! One of the common myths about meditation is that it's a spaced-out state. However, done properly, it's hard work - it's about putting the mind in a highly focused yet relaxed state.
Jeff
Meditation doesn't have to require much brain activity to be effective. However, brain activity doesn't hinder meditation IMHO, as long as the mind remains focused on the task in hand. And you might find that you benefit from something more mentally stimulating than going 'Ommmm'!
You could try thought labeling meditation, for example: http://www.ehow.com/how_4846132_meditat ... ughts.html.But it does require concentration - the more, the better! One of the common myths about meditation is that it's a spaced-out state. However, done properly, it's hard work - it's about putting the mind in a highly focused yet relaxed state.
Jeff
Predicton wrote: Maybe relaxation and meditation techniques are the answer. They don't have to be weird, any simple repetitive task will do, as long as it doesn't require a lot of brain activity or concentration,
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SamWilson82
- Posts: 95
- Joined: Sat Jan 02, 2010 11:23 am
Learn an instrument
I got myself an acoustic guitar about 2 years ago and still practice everyday. At first it was impossible and i wanted to throw it out the window (bit like trading i suppose ) but once you start hitting goals like playing tunes you love or mastering complex chord progressions its a really calming hobbie.
I often pick it up inbetween races and watch the markets whilst playing. It stops me getting involved too early which was a big problem for me last year.
As for music whilst trading its a difficult one as you might miss out on a horse playing up etc. However listening to the adverts on ATR is enough to send anyone mental.
Try some deep breathing along to this music for 15 mins before you trade and visualize yourself with oscar on the beach with two outragous spliffs!
http://www.internet-radio.org.uk/stations/meditation/
I got myself an acoustic guitar about 2 years ago and still practice everyday. At first it was impossible and i wanted to throw it out the window (bit like trading i suppose
) but once you start hitting goals like playing tunes you love or mastering complex chord progressions its a really calming hobbie.I often pick it up inbetween races and watch the markets whilst playing. It stops me getting involved too early which was a big problem for me last year.
As for music whilst trading its a difficult one as you might miss out on a horse playing up etc. However listening to the adverts on ATR is enough to send anyone mental.
Try some deep breathing along to this music for 15 mins before you trade and visualize yourself with oscar on the beach with two outragous spliffs!
http://www.internet-radio.org.uk/stations/meditation/
PS A world-renowned trader called Bill Williams was once asked if he could sum up everything he'd learned about trading in one statement.
He couldn't think of an answer at the time, but has since said that this is the greatest piece of advice he could offer any trader:
With the wand of science,
We explain, decide, and discuss
But only in the silence
Will the market speak to us
Mr Williams is a big advocate of meditation, and also writes 'No amount of thinking can accomplish what a small amount of not thinking can'.
Jeff
He couldn't think of an answer at the time, but has since said that this is the greatest piece of advice he could offer any trader:
With the wand of science,
We explain, decide, and discuss
But only in the silence
Will the market speak to us
Mr Williams is a big advocate of meditation, and also writes 'No amount of thinking can accomplish what a small amount of not thinking can'.
Jeff