I have had an email from Betfair saying that thay stand by thier decision and they will not be offering any goodwill credits in relation to yesterdays events.
I have sent all the details to IBAS and I suggest anyone else in my position does the same.
Most of my bets were placed with half of the race left to go,looking at a tiny split sereen on ATR with no commentary.... anything could have happened.
They should pay up IMHO (from their own funds)
Leopardstown - 14:00 - Christmas Hurdle - Voler la vedette
Lagos - Why not take it up with these guys? viewtopic.php?f=5&t=5277
I'd just check with Betfair that they won't close your account if you take legal action against them!
Jeff
I'd just check with Betfair that they won't close your account if you take legal action against them!
Jeff
Betfair have a bookmakers licence and have said time and time again they see themselves as a bookmaker.
So they can void bets as they see fit, same as all the others when an error is made.
Dont think legally people have a leg to stand on really, it was a very obvious error and was voided as it would have been with any other bookmakers in existance.
So they can void bets as they see fit, same as all the others when an error is made.
Dont think legally people have a leg to stand on really, it was a very obvious error and was voided as it would have been with any other bookmakers in existance.
Freddy
I'm no lawyer, but I'm not sure it would be that simple.
For a start, Betfair's T&Cs clearly state that, in the event of a bet exceeding a customer's allowed liability being placed, the bet will stand. OK, Betfair's T&Cs also say that they have complete discretion over when to cancel a bet, but a judge might want to know why an exception was made to the usual procedure in this instance. And if the answer is 'We didn't want to lose the Mad Bomber's business', s/he might not be impressed!
And I'd imagine that there are all sorts of legal precedents relating to the financial markets, where someone has bought options or futures with money they didn't have...
Jeff
I'm no lawyer, but I'm not sure it would be that simple.
For a start, Betfair's T&Cs clearly state that, in the event of a bet exceeding a customer's allowed liability being placed, the bet will stand. OK, Betfair's T&Cs also say that they have complete discretion over when to cancel a bet, but a judge might want to know why an exception was made to the usual procedure in this instance. And if the answer is 'We didn't want to lose the Mad Bomber's business', s/he might not be impressed!
And I'd imagine that there are all sorts of legal precedents relating to the financial markets, where someone has bought options or futures with money they didn't have...
Jeff
Well i Hope they do have to pay out ,
but im 99% sure they won't unfortunatly,
to me it's no different than the guy who thought he had won 7,000000 on a white christmas bet with Ladbrokes a few years back.
again a very obvious mistake and no real chance of a payout in the real world.
, but im 99% sure they won't unfortunatly,
to me it's no different than the guy who thought he had won 7,000000 on a white christmas bet with Ladbrokes a few years back.
again a very obvious mistake and no real chance of a payout in the real world.
IMHO, that guy should have been paid out, at least up to Ladbrokes's maximum payout for a single bet.
But the courts could decide that the law relating to bookmaking isn't relevant, as Betfair are an exchange, not a bookmaker.
They might also feel that the 'technlogical failure' argument is bogus, as it didn't prevent a trade between consenting parties taking place on fair terms. It wasn't like one party was unable to cancel their unfilled orders due to a server fault, for example. Furthermore, they might take the view that, if Betfair had let someone go over their credit limit, then that's a matter between Betfair and that person, and it should not absolve Betfair of its responsibility to pay out on winning bets...
Jeff
But the courts could decide that the law relating to bookmaking isn't relevant, as Betfair are an exchange, not a bookmaker.
They might also feel that the 'technlogical failure' argument is bogus, as it didn't prevent a trade between consenting parties taking place on fair terms. It wasn't like one party was unable to cancel their unfilled orders due to a server fault, for example. Furthermore, they might take the view that, if Betfair had let someone go over their credit limit, then that's a matter between Betfair and that person, and it should not absolve Betfair of its responsibility to pay out on winning bets...
Jeff
freddy wrote: to me it's no different than the guy who thought he had won 7,000000 on a white christmas bet with Ladbrokes a few years back.
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pdupre1961
- Posts: 410
- Joined: Fri Feb 18, 2011 8:01 pm
Yes, a minus figure if not error trapped can turn into a very high plus figure when put into a variable not able to hold a minus figure.Euler wrote:I've been having a good nose around and the most plausible explanation to me comes back to this integer error.
I saw this link which explains how it can cause errors. How many sites out there have a similar error that isn't trapped?
http://weblogs.asp.net/dvravikanth/arch ... sited.aspx
It must have been a bot trying to lay to a stake of say minus £2.00; 29 x -£2.00 = -£58.00 which would be under their £5,000 liability limit. Therefore passed stage one.
Stage two, when passed to a variable not able to hold minus 200 (amount stored in pence) - becomes +2,147,483,448 pence OR £21,474,834.48 stake @ 29.00 odds.
Betfair wrote:We are still finalising our investigations and a further update will now be made tomorrow morning.
We would like to apologise for the delay in providing this update but would like be in a position to provide our customers with as much information as possible.
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JollyGreen
- Posts: 2047
- Joined: Sat Mar 21, 2009 10:06 am
Betfair wrote:We are still finalising our investigations and a further update will now be made tomorrow morning.
We would like to apologise for the delay in providing this update but would like to be in a position to provide our customers with as much information as possible, provided it isn't too revealing and doesn't push us deeper into the shit!
I was initially surprised by this earnest display from Betfair - it's most unlike them to take communication with customers so seriously!
Then I looked at their share price - it's down 2.75% since yesterday's close: http://uk.finance.yahoo.com/q?s=BET.L
Jeff
Then I looked at their share price - it's down 2.75% since yesterday's close: http://uk.finance.yahoo.com/q?s=BET.L
Jeff
Euler wrote:Betfair wrote:We are still finalising our investigations and a further update will now be made tomorrow morning.
We would like to apologise for the delay in providing this update but would like be in a position to provide our customers with as much information as possible.
I saw the massive layed amount but didn't participate in it knowing that it will be voided just like another Irish race that got voided several weeks ago. I know some people are disappointed by something so unusual and so large and it's not in anybody's interest to stand. Who knows we might be on the wrong side of something cataclysmic event taking place then what?
Betfair shouldn't allowed this to have happened but it did and it may be damaging not only to Betfair but us the users as negative publicity can only reduce the activities on the exchange and real punters who most on this forum get their profit from will use traditional bookies.
Its pity that Betfair, who claims to be a technology company and not a bookie, not to have robust enough system for this to take place. If we should be annoyed then it should be for this fact and not for not honoring this outlandish odd on gigantic scale. Let’s hope that this serves as a wakeup call and Betfair invest some real cash in strengthening their IT infrastructure and prevent such incident or other security breaches from taking place.
Betfair shouldn't allowed this to have happened but it did and it may be damaging not only to Betfair but us the users as negative publicity can only reduce the activities on the exchange and real punters who most on this forum get their profit from will use traditional bookies.
Its pity that Betfair, who claims to be a technology company and not a bookie, not to have robust enough system for this to take place. If we should be annoyed then it should be for this fact and not for not honoring this outlandish odd on gigantic scale. Let’s hope that this serves as a wakeup call and Betfair invest some real cash in strengthening their IT infrastructure and prevent such incident or other security breaches from taking place.
Betfair's £23m betting liability was caused by small-scale customer - http://www.guardian.co.uk/sport/2011/de ... um=twitter
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pdupre1961
- Posts: 410
- Joined: Fri Feb 18, 2011 8:01 pm
I know everyone wants to believe that it was something sinister, however it was most probably just a simple program code change by Betfair, that allowed a (minus) bet to slip through to the market unchecked.
We will know in the morning
Maybe, if we all moved over to BetDaq on mass, then Betfair would get a shock and get their house in order, ie. stop fiddling with the set up they already have.
If the share price dropped to £2.00, then the greedy bastards would realise how important their customers are, again.
We will know in the morning
Maybe, if we all moved over to BetDaq on mass, then Betfair would get a shock and get their house in order, ie. stop fiddling with the set up they already have.
If the share price dropped to £2.00, then the greedy bastards would realise how important their customers are, again.