Excuses, Excuses, Excuses

[firlandsfarm]

Hi all, I'm back ... had a small op followed by a pre-booked vacation. But I see you have found plenty to talk about in my absence The next five years are going to be most entertaining.

So many broken promises and exposed lies in the first 2 months ... It's so much harder in government than in opposition especially when your criticisms of the past Government come home to haunt you. What was it now? Ah yes, we will reduce your heating costs ... I wonder how many pensioners will agree they have. When it was rumoured the Conservatives might remove the Winter Fuel Payment didn't they/Starmer say up to 4,000 pensioners could die? It seems now that now they won't die ... I wonder what's changed, maybe it's a benefit of global warming! But note also if the Conservatives had done so the money would have gone into the nation's coffers and not used to increase train driver salaries from £60k by £10k to £70k.

What about cronyism? Didn't Labour say they would get rid of it? So what do they call all the senior Civil Service job appointments awarded to advisers and donors?

Talking of donors ... Starmer seems to have done well doesn't he. The most donated to MP by a mile. But it's not just him, the highly placed also rans in the donations received table are also Labour. BTW, can anyone explain why he needs a £2,000+ pair of glasses? Is it because the free box at Emirates Stadium is too far away from the pitch?

If that has all happened in 2 months I wonder what the next 58 have in store.

[firlandsfarm]

Oh, I forgot to mention the most amusing part of catching up was reading some knock those who may emigrate to avoid the expected taxes. That was the funniest hypercritical joke I have ever heard. All those criticisms of the 1% who contribute 29% by those who are on this forum because they have or want an income stream that is tax free!! It beggars belief that those who do not pay their fair share should criticise those who have for wanting to protect themselves going forward!

[sionascaig]

If that has all happened in 2 months I wonder what the next 58 have in store.

It is quite a stunning fall from grace...

Screenshot 2024-09-23 105042.png

I see there is to be a corruption investigation into Asylum costs & the Covid contract investigation that Sunak shelved re-opened..

Jury defo out although alternatives look as bad as ever.

Next test will be Scottish elections and whether Labour can maintain a high poll rating...

[greenmark]

Oh, I forgot to mention the most amusing part of catching up was reading some knock those who may emigrate to avoid the expected taxes. That was the funniest hypercritical joke I have ever heard. All those criticisms of the 1% who contribute 29% by those who are on this forum because they have or want an income stream that is tax free!! It beggars belief that those who do not pay their fair share should criticise those who have for wanting to protect themselves going forward!

"That was the funniest hypercritical joke I have ever heard."

I think you meant hypocritical. This isn't pedantry, the difference is important here.
hypercritical means excessively critical, hypocrisy is the expression of beliefs that one does not adhere to.

But all politicians milk their status. And the PM's salary (as BJ said) is chicken feed.
The PM is supported by the state and anyone that chooses to supply goods and services.

In that context having a billionaire that can fund themselves should work well.
Did Sunak work well?

[jamesedwards]

Oh, I forgot to mention the most amusing part of catching up was reading some knock those who may emigrate to avoid the expected taxes. That was the funniest hypercritical joke I have ever heard. All those criticisms of the 1% who contribute 29% by those who are on this forum because they have or want an income stream that is tax free!! It beggars belief that those who do not pay their fair share should criticise those who have for wanting to protect themselves going forward!

"That was the funniest hypercritical joke I have ever heard."

I think you meant hypocritical. This isn't pedantry, the difference is important here.
hypercritical means excessively critical, hypocrisy is the expression of beliefs that one does not adhere to.

But all politicians milk their status. And the PM's salary (as BJ said) is chicken feed.
The PM is supported by the state and anyone that chooses to supply goods and services.

In that context having a billionaire that can fund themselves should work well.
Did Sunak work well?

We should properly compensate our democratic representatives. A decent MP, let alone a minister, can easily earn more in the private sector with far less workload and responsibility. The Prime Minister salary of £160k is a joke. No wonder the government ends up a dubious mix of quality, relying very much on the handful that put public service ahead of personal gain.

650 MPs and their offices cost around £140,000,000 per year. This may sound excessive, yet they are responsible for the allocation and spend of £2,300,000,000,000 per year. That's 0.006%. I would rather spend more to attract better quality people who will make better decisions and spend our money more efficiently. But of course this won't happen because it's become fashionable to demonise our own elected representatives.

[Euler]

I think there are differing grades of MP's as well.

My region kicked out our MP, who was pretty good. We have had a string of decent ones, ones that work for the region, are established in parliament and have some influence.

They have been replaced with a Lib Dem MP who has no political experience and no commercial experience whatsoever. She has no influence, skill or experience but will net £500k for her term on the backbenchers voting for whatever she is told to vote for.

Total waste of space.

[greenmark]

The title of this thread applies to both (although there are others) parties.
I am surprised by the speed and venom with which the media is going after Labour.
This doesn't help sort the country out.
All this fluff about Starmer's suits, glasses and freebie footy corporate hospitality is frankly ridiculous.
For the latter he declared every gift from all those clubs.
Where is the potential for political corruption there?

Sunak also declared his gifted helicopter rides.

Surely, transparency is the key here. If an MP is taking money to further a commercial or political cause that needs to be punished.

[jamesedwards]

The title of this thread applies to both (although there are others) parties.
I am surprised by the speed and venom with which the media is going after Labour.
This doesn't help sort the country out.
All this fluff about Starmer's suits, glasses and freebie footy corporate hospitality is frankly ridiculous.
For the latter he declared every gift from all those clubs.
Where is the potential for political corruption there?

Sunak also declared his gifted helicopter rides.

Surely, transparency is the key here. If an MP is taking money to further a commercial or political cause that needs to be punished.

The nonsense visible on social media platforms against the new Labour leaders is very similar to the nonsense seen against Tory leaders in the last few years. I always assumed it was generated by people with political agendas but I'm starting to wonder whether it could be foreign states aiming to destabilise the country. Do people really care whether Keir Starmer buys his own glasses or how Boris pays for new wallpaper? Or do they need to be whipped up into a frenzy by social media first?

If you head down certain TikTok rabbit holes you come across 100% Russian propaganda warning how the UK is about to be blown into oblivion for continuing to supply Ukraine with weapons. It wouldn't surprise me if there was an entire Russian espionage industry focused on social media manipulation. And if Russia is at it then most likely many other countries are too.

[Archery1969]

The UK has got a bigger problem coming down the pipeline being Armed Forces recruitment. It’s way down, people are not joining. Hell, why would they.

Taking into account those who retire or switch to private companies then unless recruitment significantly picks then the UK won’t be able to meet its current military obligations overseas.

Plus think about it, effectively the Armed Forces are on call 24/7 and not allowed overtime payments. That effectively means ranks below Sergeant are earning less than £3.00 per hour. Would anyone here work for that ?

[greenmark]

The UK has got a bigger problem coming down the pipeline being Armed Forces recruitment. It’s way down, people are not joining. Hell, why would they.

Taking into account those who retire or switch to private companies then unless recruitment significantly picks then the UK won’t be able to meet its current military obligations overseas.

Plus think about it, effectively the Armed Forces are on call 24/7 and not allowed overtime payments. That effectively means ranks below Sergeant are earning less than £3.00 per hour. Would anyone here work for that ?

Don't they get accomodation paid for?
Not decrying pro soldiers or armed forces in general. The changes in the world order have proved the value of the armed forces.
I would be furious if any of those people retired on anything less than a final salary pension. But I know little about it and googling hasn't helped.

[Archery1969]

The UK has got a bigger problem coming down the pipeline being Armed Forces recruitment. It’s way down, people are not joining. Hell, why would they.

Taking into account those who retire or switch to private companies then unless recruitment significantly picks then the UK won’t be able to meet its current military obligations overseas.

Plus think about it, effectively the Armed Forces are on call 24/7 and not allowed overtime payments. That effectively means ranks below Sergeant are earning less than £3.00 per hour. Would anyone here work for that ?

Don't they get accomodation paid for?
Not decrying pro soldiers or armed forces in general. The changes in the world order have proved the value of the armed forces.
I would be furious if any of those people retired on anything less than a final salary pension. But I know little about it and googling hasn't helped.

When in the UK £38 per week is deducted for food and between £75 and £480 is deducted for accommodation, depending on the type.

When overseas there are no deductions.

[greenmark]

The UK has got a bigger problem coming down the pipeline being Armed Forces recruitment. It’s way down, people are not joining. Hell, why would they.

Taking into account those who retire or switch to private companies then unless recruitment significantly picks then the UK won’t be able to meet its current military obligations overseas.

Plus think about it, effectively the Armed Forces are on call 24/7 and not allowed overtime payments. That effectively means ranks below Sergeant are earning less than £3.00 per hour. Would anyone here work for that ?

Don't they get accomodation paid for?
Not decrying pro soldiers or armed forces in general. The changes in the world order have proved the value of the armed forces.
I would be furious if any of those people retired on anything less than a final salary pension. But I know little about it and googling hasn't helped.

When in the UK £38 per week is deducted for food and between £75 and £480 is deducted for accommodation, depending on the type.

When overseas there are no deductions.

Good grief. I really didn't know that. The next question then is - why did you (or anyone else) join up?

[Archery1969]

Don't they get accomodation paid for?
Not decrying pro soldiers or armed forces in general. The changes in the world order have proved the value of the armed forces.
I would be furious if any of those people retired on anything less than a final salary pension. But I know little about it and googling hasn't helped.

When in the UK £38 per week is deducted for food and between £75 and £480 is deducted for accommodation, depending on the type.

When overseas there are no deductions.

Good grief. I really didn't know that. The next question then is - why did you (or anyone else) join up?

People have multiple of reasons:

- Live in areas with litter job prospects.
- Leave school with no qualifications.
- Hoping to learn a trade or get a formal qualification.
- Like the idea of traveling the world.
- Some get into trouble and tell the magistrate or Crown court judge they plan on joining the armed forces. Courts tend to look favourable on this depending on why you are before them. Cheaper than Prison and may do you some good type of mentality.
- Watched too many war films growing up and think it will be cool to run around with a gun shooting people.

To be honest, looking back, not too sure why I joined up, probably the last point.

[greenmark]

When in the UK £38 per week is deducted for food and between £75 and £480 is deducted for accommodation, depending on the type.

When overseas there are no deductions.

Good grief. I really didn't know that. The next question then is - why did you (or anyone else) join up?

People have multiple of reasons:

- Live in areas with litter job prospects.
- Leave school with no qualifications.
- Hoping to learn a trade or get a formal qualification.
- Like the idea of traveling the world.
- Some get into trouble and tell the magistrate or Crown court judge they plan on joining the armed forces. Courts tend to look favourable on this depending on why you are before them. Cheaper than Prison and may do you some good type of mentality.
- Watched too many war films growing up and think it will be cool to run around with a gun shooting people.

To be honest, looking back, not too sure why I joined up, probably the last point.

My Dad joied up because he was going to be conscripted anyway. Also points 1 to 3. Plus he was still mourning the loss of his childhood sweetheart at 17 to leukemia and said he didn't really care whether he lived or died.

[Derek27]

Starmer promises that all homeless veterans will be offered homes.