its an attitude which will be their downfall .
Lots of bigger companies have gone down due to bad customer service .
Who is to say they didn’t cause the outage as they were on other end of a bad trade
Betfair Down / Betfair site crash
lol, i think we're getting into Twin Towers Conspiracy territory now....leewillo75 wrote: ↑Wed Aug 22, 2018 9:56 amWho is to say they didn’t cause the outage as they were on other end of a bad trade
Let me know if you find an app that can circumvent betfair crashing, thanks.johndunlop1000 wrote: ↑Wed Aug 22, 2018 9:31 amuninstalling Bet Angel sorry to say.... How can I have any faith that when I open a position, like i did last night, that Betfair won't crash and leave me with NO way of closing my position.
I took a hammering last night and as usual Betfair just shrugged thier shoulder and said "tough shit"..
Thanks for the Fun Peter Webb but can't trust these Applications any longer.
Bye
I genuinely feel for those who lost serious money yesterday, every time there's an outage I know there's someone who lost their bank through no fault of their own. The sad truth is you have to try and be prepared for things like that, and if possible close your positions elsewhere on Betdaq or Sportsbook or at least minimize your liabilities.
I consider myself lucky over the years that I never lost anything to outages until yesterday, most of my bank was exposed several times in the past but it was always on prematch football so I had enough time for the exchange to come back online. I feel grateful that I was caught out on the back side of the book with 600 in liability, it could have easily exposed me for 5000 if the outage happened at a different time, although maybe I would have preferred that because I could have closed that position on their Sportsbook if needed. I tried to make the best of it and had the option inplay to cut the loss in half but instead I turned my liability into a value bet which almost won.
I'm not complaining and I know there are people far worse off, but you just have to accept it as a bad day at the office and move on. Just don't let it tilt you and please don't go chasing that loss whatever it is, chances are you will only make it worse.
I consider myself lucky over the years that I never lost anything to outages until yesterday, most of my bank was exposed several times in the past but it was always on prematch football so I had enough time for the exchange to come back online. I feel grateful that I was caught out on the back side of the book with 600 in liability, it could have easily exposed me for 5000 if the outage happened at a different time, although maybe I would have preferred that because I could have closed that position on their Sportsbook if needed. I tried to make the best of it and had the option inplay to cut the loss in half but instead I turned my liability into a value bet which almost won.
I'm not complaining and I know there are people far worse off, but you just have to accept it as a bad day at the office and move on. Just don't let it tilt you and please don't go chasing that loss whatever it is, chances are you will only make it worse.
Always amazing to see so-called 'Pro' traders unaware of major outages especially when they occur at such busy times!
Euler issued an 'Amber' alert at 18:43leewillo75 wrote: ↑Wed Aug 22, 2018 7:57 amanyone know the official outage time last night as Ive had football trades voided placed before the actual outage occured ie trades placed and matched before 7pm
then a 'Red' Alert at 19:06 that Betfair are struggling to turn horse races in-play
OR - radically adopt a different approach whereby trading is no longer carried out in favour of value bets that expire, rather than are offset and traded out.
Not for me, but does make you think. (Oh, hang on, isn't that a traditional bookies
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andyfuller
- Posts: 4619
- Joined: Wed Mar 25, 2009 12:23 pm
It is over 8 years since I started this thread 
and little seems to have changed, I blame Betfair for this but I also blame the customers to a much lesser degree.
I haven't read a huge amount of the recent posts, just a quick scan now, but it appears Betfair are still not implementing one of the simplest ways of making things fairer.
It won't solve the fundamental issues but it would go a long way to protecting pre-race traders.
The idea is that Betfair implement the technology that I argued for years ago that allows them to roll a market back to its true off position, this can be done in financial markets.
It seems last night that a race was not turned inplay but bets were still matched during the race.
Subsequently Betfair have voided all the bets that were matched after the off time as they always do when a market fails to be turned inplay, and I feel is the correct decision (to an extent, see below).
Caught up in those voided bets are all the people who set their bets to Take SP at the off. There is no reason at all (other than lack of investment) as to why Betfair can not roll the market back to the official off time and reinstate all those bets that were placed in good faith and had Betfair done their job of turning the market inplay would have been matched at the SP.
The issue I beleive is something to do with how Betfair record the status of a bet, be it, cancel, take sp or keep, at the off. Though with investment this should surely be fixable.
So at present you are left praying that the horse you layed and have a counter take sp back bet wins and never trades up to your price, or, if you backed it and have a counter take sp lay bet never trades down to your price.
If you move the bet to make sure it isn't matched, the system actually cancels the first bet and re-submits a new bet which will now have been placed at the off and is therefore voided.
I can't remember what happens to bets that were placed pre race, set to take sp, but you then cancel during the race, say for example you had backed horse A and it is going to win so you cancel your take sp lay. I can't remember how Betfair handle these bets, are they voided or reinstated? I think they are no longer seen by Betfair so are ignored and remain cancelled.
So anyway that is my suggestion to Betfair now and was years ago.
So why do I partially blame customers (and I include myself in that)?
No one, to my knowledge has ever forced the issue on Betfair to do this. The way to achieve this would be to get a ruling imposed on them whereby they had to do it. I think in a court, this argument would hold up or it could be done via the regulator. But (and it may have changed) people were so worried about Betfair closing their account that people just accepted it each and every time it happened. They ranted and raved on the forums but didn't take the risk of starting a case.
I went part of the way by starting a case with IBAS due to being caught in the above situation in 2012 (it is detailed somewhere here on the forum) however, Betfair paid me the money back as a goodwill gesture without offering the money, they just paid it. In hindsight I should have turned the money down, despite them paying it to me automatically and pursued the case so that a ruling could be made. However, reading back over the emails this morning it appears IBAS were happy to close the case as soon as Betfair told them they had paid the money back. So I am not sure if it would have been possible to get them to make a ruling.
So my point is, don't just complain to Betfair if you have been left out of pocket, take it further. Until people do this nothing is going to change and in another 8 years you, or most likely another batch of users, will be still posting on this thread saying how badly they are being treated by Betfair.
and little seems to have changed, I blame Betfair for this but I also blame the customers to a much lesser degree.I haven't read a huge amount of the recent posts, just a quick scan now, but it appears Betfair are still not implementing one of the simplest ways of making things fairer.
It won't solve the fundamental issues but it would go a long way to protecting pre-race traders.
The idea is that Betfair implement the technology that I argued for years ago that allows them to roll a market back to its true off position, this can be done in financial markets.
It seems last night that a race was not turned inplay but bets were still matched during the race.
Subsequently Betfair have voided all the bets that were matched after the off time as they always do when a market fails to be turned inplay, and I feel is the correct decision (to an extent, see below).
Caught up in those voided bets are all the people who set their bets to Take SP at the off. There is no reason at all (other than lack of investment) as to why Betfair can not roll the market back to the official off time and reinstate all those bets that were placed in good faith and had Betfair done their job of turning the market inplay would have been matched at the SP.
The issue I beleive is something to do with how Betfair record the status of a bet, be it, cancel, take sp or keep, at the off. Though with investment this should surely be fixable.
So at present you are left praying that the horse you layed and have a counter take sp back bet wins and never trades up to your price, or, if you backed it and have a counter take sp lay bet never trades down to your price.
If you move the bet to make sure it isn't matched, the system actually cancels the first bet and re-submits a new bet which will now have been placed at the off and is therefore voided.
I can't remember what happens to bets that were placed pre race, set to take sp, but you then cancel during the race, say for example you had backed horse A and it is going to win so you cancel your take sp lay. I can't remember how Betfair handle these bets, are they voided or reinstated? I think they are no longer seen by Betfair so are ignored and remain cancelled.
So anyway that is my suggestion to Betfair now and was years ago.
So why do I partially blame customers (and I include myself in that)?
No one, to my knowledge has ever forced the issue on Betfair to do this. The way to achieve this would be to get a ruling imposed on them whereby they had to do it. I think in a court, this argument would hold up or it could be done via the regulator. But (and it may have changed) people were so worried about Betfair closing their account that people just accepted it each and every time it happened. They ranted and raved on the forums but didn't take the risk of starting a case.
I went part of the way by starting a case with IBAS due to being caught in the above situation in 2012 (it is detailed somewhere here on the forum) however, Betfair paid me the money back as a goodwill gesture without offering the money, they just paid it. In hindsight I should have turned the money down, despite them paying it to me automatically and pursued the case so that a ruling could be made. However, reading back over the emails this morning it appears IBAS were happy to close the case as soon as Betfair told them they had paid the money back. So I am not sure if it would have been possible to get them to make a ruling.
So my point is, don't just complain to Betfair if you have been left out of pocket, take it further. Until people do this nothing is going to change and in another 8 years you, or most likely another batch of users, will be still posting on this thread saying how badly they are being treated by Betfair.
Great post as always Andyandyfuller wrote: ↑Wed Aug 22, 2018 12:59 pm
No one, to my knowledge has ever forced the issue on Betfair to do this.
Just to pick up on this part, I did notice something similar from someone else (unless it was you) in a reply someone posted to one of Peters tweets regarding this
https://twitter.com/betangel/status/1032014006125559809
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andyfuller
- Posts: 4619
- Joined: Wed Mar 25, 2009 12:23 pm
That would be meDallas wrote: ↑Wed Aug 22, 2018 1:07 pmGreat post as always Andyandyfuller wrote: ↑Wed Aug 22, 2018 12:59 pm
No one, to my knowledge has ever forced the issue on Betfair to do this.
Just to pick up on this part, I did notice something similar from someone else (unless it was you) in a reply someone posted to one of Peters tweets regarding this
https://twitter.com/betangel/status/1032014006125559809
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spreadbetting
- Posts: 3140
- Joined: Sun Jan 31, 2010 8:06 pm
They told me as far back as July 2009 they were going to implement an automated solution to the problem of take SP bets matched on void IR markets, Andy 
Should we have to manually reconcile the BSP in the future, we may have to make account adjustments to reflect ‘Take SP’ exchange bets, pending an automated solution. However we are working to ensure that such bets will be automatically picked up in any manual BSP reconciliation process.
Lost a truckload myself. Typically on a "bet and forget" in case I am distracted or something like this happens etc strategy, typically had all 5 go against me. Charlton game remained closed till end of kickoff, others remained open. Madness.....25pc of bank yesterday.
"Its cloud-based architecture, supported by a company in Romania."
That doesn't instill me with a great deal of confidence.
I have screenshots of the Asane debacle, i won't post it without some redaction but 3hrs after the game finished odds were flying around. They subsequently voided all those bets after the match I think.
Has anyone written to Gambling Commission to complain directly? Euler? Does anyone get anywhere?
Can you imagine this happening on the LSE, what the uproar would be......FCA fines would be huge.
"Its cloud-based architecture, supported by a company in Romania."
That doesn't instill me with a great deal of confidence.
I have screenshots of the Asane debacle, i won't post it without some redaction but 3hrs after the game finished odds were flying around. They subsequently voided all those bets after the match I think.
Has anyone written to Gambling Commission to complain directly? Euler? Does anyone get anywhere?
Can you imagine this happening on the LSE, what the uproar would be......FCA fines would be huge.
spreadbetting wrote: ↑Wed Aug 22, 2018 1:15 pmThey told me as far back as July 2009 they were going to implement an automated solution to the problem of take SP bets matched on void IR markets, Andy
Should we have to manually reconcile the BSP in the future, we may have to make account adjustments to reflect ‘Take SP’ exchange bets, pending an automated solution. However we are working to ensure that such bets will be automatically picked up in any manual BSP reconciliation process.
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