Betfair Premium Charge

[Euler]

Can feel another blog post coming on tonight
in fact if you speak your mind Peter I'm sure the press will pick it up??

I'll do a post tonight, but I'll wait till the results tomorrow for a proper post. I will be embarrassed for them if results are skyward and so are charges! After all they have position this and other premium charges as a way to balance out the cost of doing business. The problem is that is how they position the last charge, and this is how they will position the next one and the one after that.

[steven1976]

Someone will do it bigger and better than betfair. Trading on betting is only 10 years old after all. If some of the big bookies were wise they would clean up and offer a similar platform on the back of their brand and to their customers. Its amazing how many people still dont understand the culture of backing and laying.

[Iron]

I'd say most punters don't even understand the decimal system of odds!

J

Its amazing how many people still dont understand the culture of backing and laying.

[freddy]

Someone will do it bigger and better than betfair. Trading on betting is only 10 years old after all. If some of the big bookies were wise they would clean up and offer a similar platform on the back of their brand and to their customers. Its amazing how many people still dont understand the culture of backing and laying.

The problem is the exchanges (not even betfair) generate the kind of profits that the big bookies do.

So i dont see that happening really, it would kill there profits if anything.

we need a exchange that knows its'a an exchange and stays that way, not a mixture of the two like BF.

[superfrank]

The problem is the exchanges (not even betfair) generate the kind of profits that the big bookies do.

So i dont see that happening really, it would kill there profits if anything.

we need a exchange that knows its'a an exchange and stays that way.

Yeah, what we really need is an exchange that is run as a co-operative in the true spirit of a p2p sporting exchange. Imagine if John Lewis operated a sports betting exchange and we could all be partners... 2% commission, no PC and profits split/reinvested in the tech.

[steven1976]

Does anyone wonder if the reason they are doing this is not just to increase profits but maybe they feel that by scaring away the consistant winners it will allow others to "betfair"? They may feel that a small group of 500 people (number of people someone said it will effect) have to much control of the markets and are able, to a certain extent use their wallets to influence prices. They may feel this will in the long term encourage more newcomers to stay longer and therefore bring more new money into the pot.

As peter mentions, they gave him a personal call boasting that he was in the top 99.99999%, it would be interesting to know why they told him this and did they to some extent try to find out if he will stay or move on? Or was it just some jobsworth who got the pleasure of telling him knowing that he already is very unhappy at 20% PC and that usually they never call him. I fancy it wasn't a call to try and keep him as a loyal customer.

[Iron]

I think Andy may have hit the nail on the head when he said that, if a trader earns £100,000 and keeps £80,000 after PC, that's £80,000 that leaves Betfair for good. However, if Betfair were a community of ordinary punters, people would keep on recycling their returns, with Betfair taking their 5% cut each time, until that £80,000 was in Betfair's pockets.

Jeff

Does anyone wonder if the reason they are doing this is not just to increase profits but maybe they feel that by scaring away the consistant winners it will allow others to "betfair"?

[steven1976]

I bet Rupert Murdoch never thought Facebook would happen when he bought MySpace. It did!
One day, USA, China, India etc... will open to gambling. I know its not going to be for a long time but there will be a future for trading sports. This is just the beginning!
If I had access to a 100 mil I'd probably give it a bash myself!

[superfrank]

Does anyone wonder if the reason they are doing this is not just to increase profits but maybe they feel that by scaring away the consistant winners it will allow others to "betfair"? They may feel that a small group of 500 people (number of people someone said it will effect) have to much control of the markets and are able, to a certain extent use their wallets to influence prices. They may feel this will in the long term encourage more newcomers to stay longer and therefore bring more new money into the pot.

I think the primary motive is to get more cash, but maybe they also think it could have beneficial knock-on effects.

[Iron]

You might find this thread interesting: viewtopic.php?f=17&t=3996&hilit=ecosystem

Jeff

I bet Rupert Murdoch never thought Facebook would happen when he bought MySpace. It did!
One day, USA, China, India etc... will open to gambling. I know its not going to be for a long time but there will be a future for trading sports. This is just the beginning!
If I had access to a 100 mil I'd probably give it a bash myself!

[steven1976]

Good link to that post thanks. That's why I said you need 100mil. No point doing it half hearted, you would need a huge advertising budget to pull in the real punters initially.Proba

[oscar123]

Since the premium charge came in there seem to be less adverts for betfair than ever.

If you watch the racing on C4 on a saturday afternoon every other advert is for paddy power or 365 with their free bet and money back offers.

Everybody who I know that bets casually, ie losing punters, do so through bookmakers. They do so because they can, and its far more simpler.

I dont see how they can attract these casual punters. I havent seen a betfair advert since that one with the man and the bottle of milk.

A lot of the people moving to betfair must have done so on the back of hearing about the big winners, reading the forums and trading blogs etc. Where is the incentive to join now? A lot of the recent losers would have joined on the back of hoping they could become a big winner too. Nobody joins wanting to lose. Now the message is if you win, we will take 40% of your profits.

All the other bookmakers seem to have adverts on every 5 minutes, where are all the betfair adverts?

[LeTiss]

That's an excellent point Oscar

The only new customers attracted to BF are newbie traders, and this makes them realise that it's a waste of time

I'm still kinda shocked by today's events, IMO Betfair are fooked

[AReasonedView]

We've all said before when the 20% came in that it was the end for Betfair and it wasn't but who in their right mind is going to earn £1,000 & give £600 back in charges. As more and more people approach £250k profit they will disappear off Betfair - most of these will be current large liquidity providers - if bookies want to lay off in future and the liquidity isn't on Betfair then they might find it has migrated to Purple and the word will spread - saying that I'm not totally convinced as yet Purple will get their act in order but Betfair are trying their best to help IMHO. Also if people are forced to move Betfair will lose some massive amounts in commission from these big players. If they want to keep the small players then they will only provide pennies in commission and if funds move elsewhere their interest gained on customer deposits will reduce big time. Also this time it seems gamblers (as opposed to just traders) will also run into problems now with the new charges. It could be a combined traders/gamblers force the market to shift to Purple. I can only see Purple growing and Betfair shrinking myself after todays news. It might turn out OK again long term but it's a rocky road ahead now it seems.

[chuck536]

Shocking news!