How to not exceed predefined risk limit ?

[automatic]

Hi, I've tried searching for an answer on the forum but so far I've been unsuccessful. I need to achieve that for a given single strategy my predefined risk limit is not exceeded.

For example, I have a horse scalping strategy, the strategy continuously scalps Back & Lay, then always greening. But today an annoying thing happened to me where the robot started placing bets at odds of 1.01 and I had accidentally set the bet value to liability instead of fixed stake... so instead of 1 pound it was 100.

I need to set a maximum risk limit for each strategy. For example, if I had set a limit of £50, these bets would not have gone through at all.

I have found instructions on the forum for using "Store value", but if I understand correctly, this method only determines how much the current open risk is in the market and if it is greater than that value, the robot will not place any more bets. But I need this restriction to be preventive, i.e. not even to be able to place any bet that would increase my risk above the required level. I hope you understand me and someone will be able to help me.

Thank you

[Anbell]

Hi, I've tried searching for an answer on the forum but so far I've been unsuccessful. I need to achieve that for a given single strategy my predefined risk limit is not exceeded.

For example, I have a horse scalping strategy, the strategy continuously scalps Back & Lay, then always greening. But today an annoying thing happened to me where the robot started placing bets at odds of 1.01 and I had accidentally set the bet value to liability instead of fixed stake... so instead of 1 pound it was 100.

I need to set a maximum risk limit for each strategy. For example, if I had set a limit of £50, these bets would not have gone through at all.

I have found instructions on the forum for using "Store value", but if I understand correctly, this method only determines how much the current open risk is in the market and if it is greater than that value, the robot will not place any more bets. But I need this restriction to be preventive, i.e. not even to be able to place any bet that would increase my risk above the required level. I hope you understand me and someone will be able to help me.

Thank you

One simple option for a newbie is to reduce the $$ in your account/wallet.

[automatic]

Hi, I've tried searching for an answer on the forum but so far I've been unsuccessful. I need to achieve that for a given single strategy my predefined risk limit is not exceeded.

For example, I have a horse scalping strategy, the strategy continuously scalps Back & Lay, then always greening. But today an annoying thing happened to me where the robot started placing bets at odds of 1.01 and I had accidentally set the bet value to liability instead of fixed stake... so instead of 1 pound it was 100.

I need to set a maximum risk limit for each strategy. For example, if I had set a limit of £50, these bets would not have gone through at all.

I have found instructions on the forum for using "Store value", but if I understand correctly, this method only determines how much the current open risk is in the market and if it is greater than that value, the robot will not place any more bets. But I need this restriction to be preventive, i.e. not even to be able to place any bet that would increase my risk above the required level. I hope you understand me and someone will be able to help me.

Thank you

One simple option for a newbie is to reduce the $$ in your account/wallet.

Thanks for the reply, but of course I know this and it's meaningless because then I couldn't do the other stuff. I just want to give these individual robots such restrictions that they can never exceed the risk I set. That was my question.

[jamesedwards]

There is a condition under stored values called 'the profit/loss of a selection'.

Set this condition on your trigger rule that says the selection profit/loss has to be greater than -£x for it to trigger with X being your max desired exposure.

And use practise mode to test first so mistakes like this can be discovered before you go live.

[automatic]

There is a condition under stored values called 'the profit/loss of a selection'.

Set this condition on your trigger rule that says the selection profit/loss has to be greater than -£x for it to trigger with X being your max desired exposure.

And use practise mode to test first so mistakes like this can be discovered before you go live.

Thank you very much for your reply. I'm probably still doing something wrong, but first I chose the variable "MaxExposure" and set it to -10.

MaxExposure.png

Then I added a condition to the order that enters trades into the market, so that the order is only executed if the "Profit & Loss" is greater than the "MaxExposure" value.

Condition.png

However, now no trade is sent to the market. I have tried various variations, but so far without success. Any tips?

[sionascaig]

Check that the MaxExposure is being set for EVERY selection?

You should be able to tell from the log whether the SV is being set for each selection as you have ticked the box to write to log.

Alternatively can set MaxExposure at the Market level & condition at Market level (for each selection).

[jamesedwards]

You don't need to create a stored value. It's already there in the conditions tab.

Picture27.png

[automatic]

You don't need to create a stored value. It's already there in the conditions tab.

Picture27.png

I can't figure it out. How is it possible that I have a value of '-10', but the robot calmly sends hundreds of pounds into the market when I set the trade size to 100 pounds?

Stored Value Exceeding exposure.png

[jamesedwards]

You don't need to create a stored value. It's already there in the conditions tab.

Picture27.png

I can't figure it out. How is it possible that I have a value of '-10', but the robot calmly sends hundreds of pounds into the market when I set the trade size to 100 pounds?

Stored Value Exceeding exposure.png

The 'profit & loss of a selection' is the profit or loss based on if that selection goes on to win. The value is based on bets that have already been matched across the total market. eg back £10 @ 5.0 on horseA then the 'profit & loss of a selection' will report +40 on horseA and -10 on all other selections.

On reflection I don't think this will help with what you are trying to do. It seems you want to prevent a bet being placed into the market that could potentially take your exposure over X?

[sionascaig]

You initial bet needs to be < the the absolute value of max exposure.

The P&L check wont kick in until 1st best is matched... (as P&L = 0 before a bet is matched)

If you want a MaxExposure of -10 then would suggest initial liability bet has to be <=10...

I suppose the question is why are you submitting bets well in excess of your max exposure?

[jamesedwards]

There is another condition called 'the net stake of the selection'. You could use this to track the net stake (back minus lay) of a selection but, again, this is only going to include bets already matched and won't include any additional exposure of a potential new bet.

There is a master 'maximum liability' setting under settings but I've never used this and not sure how it works.
https://www.betangel.com/user-guide/sta ... ility.html

[automatic]

You don't need to create a stored value. It's already there in the conditions tab.

Picture27.png

I can't figure it out. How is it possible that I have a value of '-10', but the robot calmly sends hundreds of pounds into the market when I set the trade size to 100 pounds?

Stored Value Exceeding exposure.png

On reflection I don't think this will help with what you are trying to do. It seems you want to prevent a bet being placed into the market that could potentially take your exposure over X?

Yes, that's exactly what I'm trying to do.

I suppose the question is why are you submitting bets well in excess of your max exposure?

My main activity is manual trading, but I would like to add some bots running in the background, for example for in-play or greyhounds.

Since I don't have a Master account and sub accounts, I can't allow these bots to have access to my entire balance. I would simply like to make sure that, for example, a robot that scalps greyhounds can never exceed the maximum exposure XY.

Even though I tested the robot for several days with miniature amounts, I could not predict one unusual situation in which the robot placed higher amounts than I intended.

I think more people need to address this - after all, the main point of trading is capital protection and risk management, so the first thing I want to set for the robot is that it cannot exceed my specified limit in any case, even if I made a mistake when creating it, for example.

The master limit on the whole account is also useless to me, because I want to trade horses with a bank of 1000 for example, but at the same time I want the background greyhound robot to have a limit of only 50.

It's a tough nut for me to figure out this basic thing in my opinion. If anyone who is responsible for software development is listening, I think this would be very useful from a user experience perspective:

UXdesign.png

That is, to simply have this limit immediately adjustable when the robot is created, and to log any situations where the limit should be exceeded.

[sionascaig]

There really is no need. Just follow my instruction above.

This will of course only impact bets placed by the bot.

(and remember P&L = 0 until a bet is matched)

You can control at BA level via staking options as well?

[automatic]

You initial bet needs to be < the the absolute value of max exposure.

The P&L check wont kick in until 1st best is matched... (as P&L = 0 before a bet is matched)

What if that first trade is the wrong one and exceeds my risk? Not that I want to give wrong instructions to the robot, but we are human and not infallible. One can change something in the settings by mistake. That's why I want to have a foolproof plan for how my robot will trade only within the limits I set for it.

[sionascaig]

You initial bet needs to be < the the absolute value of max exposure.

The P&L check wont kick in until 1st best is matched... (as P&L = 0 before a bet is matched)

What if that first trade is the wrong one and exceeds my risk? Not that I want to give wrong instructions to the robot, but we are human and not infallible. One can change something in the settings by mistake. That's why I want to have a foolproof plan for how my robot will trade only within the limits I set for it.

That's why you test automation in practice mode first and then move to live with "small" stakes until it behaves as you would expect?

And for what you are doing (in the bot) can use liability stakes so no way of exceeding predefined limit if that is your main driver.