Forex trading - automation software like Betangel?

[rain91]

is there a software as simple as betangel guardian automation (or spreadsheet) for any stock / forex site?
in the past, I remember there was a software similar to betangel (I think it's the same framework?)

[jimibt]

I personally use cTrader for forex/indices. However, it does require a skillset in c# (for automation -tho it can be used as purely a front end, like BA also) but the advantages it gives (coding in c#) far outweighs coding in a proprietary language.

Much as I loved BA automation back in the day, the lack of backtesting capabilities left me repeating the old adage ".. and for that reason, I'm out".

https://www.spotware.com/products/trade ... er-desktop
https://www.spotware.com/products/trade ... g-platform

As a seasoned developer (in c#), working with cTrader (and not affiliated), I can only say great things about it.

[lavenham]

I just use Metatrader 4. It is as simple or complicated as you want to make it - all depends on the system/indicators/data presentation you set up. There are even ladders if that is what you want.
Millions of rabbit holes to explore on a google search but there are no quick routes to success,- rather like horse racing trading!

[Fugazi]

Jimi has mentioned before i believe...

Much crossover bet trading to forex?

I imagine scalping doesnt work so well with the comission on Forex for one?....

[jimibt]

Much crossover bet trading to forex?

only in terms of money management techniques and discipline. but that's the same in most fields i think

I imagine scalping doesnt work so well with the comission on Forex for one?....

depends on your definition of scalping. remember of course in forex you can home in on multiple timeframes from 1 month way down to 1 second (if using ticks), so what may seem like a scalp on one timeframe is potentially a swing on another. i personally tend not to scalp as that veers too close to gambling for me (tho of course, time could be spent finding parameters and risk levels to do so - but not for me). i also don't trade manually, so scalping is something i've never got involved in.

i prefer strategies that are based on higher timeframes (m30,h4,d1) that can by systematically trialled (back and fwd tested) and don't require me being glued to the screen all day. sadly of course, that's not really the case as I'm generally working on some optimisation or developing/testing new approaches, so regrettably I am kinda stuck to the screen more than i should be.

[Fugazi]

Much crossover bet trading to forex?

only in terms of money management techniques and discipline. but that's the same in most fields i think

I imagine scalping doesnt work so well with the comission on Forex for one?....

depends on your definition of scalping. remember of course in forex you can home in on multiple timeframes from 1 month way down to 1 second (if using ticks), so what may seem like a scalp on one timeframe is potentially a swing on another. i personally tend not to scalp as that veers too close to gambling for me (tho of course, time could be spent finding parameters and risk levels to do so - but not for me). i also don't trade manually, so scalping is something i've never got involved in.

i prefer strategies that are based on higher timeframes (m30,h4,d1) that can by systematically trialled (back and fwd tested) and don't require me being glued to the screen all day. sadly of course, that's not really the case as I'm generally working on some optimisation or developing/testing new approaches, so regrettably I am kinda stuck to the screen more than i should be.

Damn. Sounds like a whole can of worms.

Maybe one day when I hit a ceiling with bet angel I may consider that. Hopefully I just keep raising the profit ceiling with Bet a Angel. Hard as it is to resist taking a look ... Im always spinning too many plates is my problem

[Bobajob]

I personally use cTrader for forex/indices. However, it does require a skillset in c# (for automation -tho it can be used as purely a front end, like BA also) but the advantages it gives (coding in c#) far outweighs coding in a proprietary language.

Much as I loved BA automation back in the day, the lack of backtesting capabilities left me repeating the old adage ".. and for that reason, I'm out".

https://www.spotware.com/products/trade ... er-desktop
https://www.spotware.com/products/trade ... g-platform

As a seasoned developer (in c#), working with cTrader (and not affiliated), I can only say great things about it.

Much as I loved BA automation back in the day, the lack of backtesting capabilities left me repeating the old adage ".. and for that reason, I'm out".

But BA allows you to look at back/previous data from which can get ideas/strategies that you can 'forward' test. - much better than 'back' testing

[Euler]

Back testing is useful to understand how the market works, but I've never found it much use in formulating strategies either in financials or sports markets.

I think it's easy, in relative terms, to make money from sports trading rather than financial trading.

[conduirez]

Be warned with Forex, back testing results are skewed in favour of profit, there are many complaints from people on forums, that the back testing showed their trading algorithm made good profit but when it went live it made a loss.

The main reason for this is the spread, which is usually 0 in back testing, the only price recorded is usually the ask price and not both the ask and bid prices, so the testing will never give a true spread at any given time.

Back testing in sports trading can give similar problems, suppose you use SP's to back test an algorithm, say to place trades 5 minutes before the off, well one examples errors could occur is looking at the spreads in greyhound racing 5 minutes before the off.

Back testing takes a lot of care setting up.

[Euler]

Back testing is statistical deja vu.

[Bobajob]

Back testing is useful to understand how the market works, but I've never found it much use in formulating strategies either in financials or sports markets.

I think it's easy, in relative terms, to make money from sports trading rather than financial trading.

Exactly - can't understand anybody giving up on BA because of lack of 'back testing' capabilities
Why

[conduirez]

Precisely, if you have read the data correctly there is no point in back testing.

[jimibt]

Be warned with Forex, back testing results are skewed in favour of profit, there are many complaints from people on forums, that the back testing showed their trading algorithm made good profit but when it went live it made a loss.

The main reason for this is the spread, which is usually 0 in back testing, the only price recorded is usually the ask price and not both the ask and bid prices, so the testing will never give a true spread at any given time.

Back testing in sports trading can give similar problems, suppose you use SP's to back test an algorithm, say to place trades 5 minutes before the off, well one examples errors could occur is looking at the spreads in greyhound racing 5 minutes before the off.

Back testing takes a lot of care setting up.

yeah -i totally concur that proper backtesting definitely has to be approached methodically and with your eyes open. I use tick data for my backtesting, which means that there is a multiple more data to churn thro in the backtest. however, the outcome being that you are reasonably sure that you are matched with the prevailing spread present as it would have been at that point in time. if you do this badly, then of course you may take shortcuts and use m1 bar data which does present the pitfalls you describe.

so to reiterate, my backtesting is not about trying to find strategies, it's more about testing the limit order and market order execution and for that reason i HAVE to use accurate tick data. below is a quick random pull on XAUUSD (the spread in this case is ticks):

[edit - image added as text looked weird]

[conduirez]

Be warned with Forex, back testing results are skewed in favour of profit, there are many complaints from people on forums, that the back testing showed their trading algorithm made good profit but when it went live it made a loss.

The main reason for this is the spread, which is usually 0 in back testing, the only price recorded is usually the ask price and not both the ask and bid prices, so the testing will never give a true spread at any given time.

Back testing in sports trading can give similar problems, suppose you use SP's to back test an algorithm, say to place trades 5 minutes before the off, well one examples errors could occur is looking at the spreads in greyhound racing 5 minutes before the off.

Back testing takes a lot of care setting up.

yeah -i totally concur that proper backtesting definitely has to be approached methodically and with your eyes open. I use tick data for my backtesting, which means that there is a multiple more data to churn thro in the backtest. however, the outcome being that you are reasonably sure that you are matched with the prevailing spread present as it would have been at that point in time. if you do this badly, then of course you may take shortcuts and use m1 bar data which does present the pitfalls you describe.

so to reiterate, my backtesting is not about trying to find strategies, it's more about testing the limit order and market order execution and for that reason i HAVE to use accurate tick data. below is a quick random pull on XAUUSD (the spread in this case is ticks):

[edit - image added as text looked weird]

That is the right way to use it.

So many people believe back testing tells them everything without checking exactly what they are doing to control it.