when do you cut your losses on tennis

[crazybass]

Hi,

I am new to the forum and bet angel and also trading. I was wondering if people have a figure in mind when to cut your losses and trade out. My background is fixed odds and I have used greening up functions etc.

I have been plodding along getting used to the software and using a small bank and have been taking two steps forward and three steps back most of the time. In particular tennis is killing me I know it is a very volatile market and while i am making a good return 4 times out of 5 that 5th one is when I wait to see if it recovers and it doesn't and I end up wiping out all gains on the 4 where I did increase my balance.

So I was just wondering if anyone can share there figures on where they would jump ship go red and shut the computer down... times I have just said f~~k it and let it run and obviously the balance I see when I log back in is not the one I want to see....

Regards

Cal

[ShaunWhite]

There is no figure.
Cut your loses when the market indicates that your position is no longer likely to be favourable. Dispassionate reassessment everytime the market changes. That's irrespective of whether you're showing a £1 loss or a £200 loss. If you wouldn't place a bet 'now', why have you got one in there now?...so get your bet out. If you would have a bet 'now', leave it in there. It sounds so easy but that's the art that's so hard to master.

Don't forget you can increase or decrease the weight of your position according to your confidence, rather than it being a straight in or out decision.

The fact you did something perfectly sensible 2 minutes ago has no relevance whatsoever on what you should do now. Things change (and they must change or you couldn't trade) and you have absolutely no control over how it changes (that's obvious). The only thing you have any control over is how you respond.

Going red is something that will happen maybe 30% (+/- 20%) of the time. It's only ever a reason to shut down your machine if that bothers you. You'll need to 'jump ship' a lot, so do it before the water is round your neck and get used to ignoring wet socks.

If tennis is killing you, don't trade it. Keep detailed stats on your results and focus on what works best to start with.

There's no room for any "f~~k it" moments, none, not one. These can be incredibly difficult for some people to stop too.

[ShaunWhite]

I've reproduced a posting by dragontrades that he made on the Todays Racing thread. It's the perfect example of mental strength when things go wrong, and they will.

When something goes badly wrong on one race don't panic stick to your edge and you will come out the other end.
Not long ago if I had a loss like that I would have to have the rest of the day off because my head would be gone.
Could have been a really sweet day, the big loss was a £30 green and I had a lot of stakes on this runner away from the price and the video was delayed, though it was perfect on every other race so I felt comfortable trading close to the off but got caught out being matched against SP and others just kept jumping in front as I was trying to get the stake out In running

[Dallas]

With tennis the movement of odds is entirely down to the score, you could say it should be the easiest sport to accept a loss on unlike pre race horse racing were price is driven by opinion and can often be back and forth with no real reasoning

So no matter what your stratergy you should have a pre-defined exit when you open your tennis trade which is nothing to do with the monetry value.

ie, if your laying the 1st set winner your pre-defined exit could be after a break of serve next set, if the player you layed broke again your greening up for a loss, if they are the one that gets broken you have your profit either way this trade is complete when this happens

Or if trading the server you should be exiting after their serve is finished regardless if they win or lose their serve. Then re-enter with another trade next time they serve. Even trading very short term like trading the breakpoint once the point is over green up and be ready for the next one.

[roger speakout]

try using automation, or whether you can program you thought into automation.

you can use the tennis trader tool to predict future prices.

maybe you can tell us a match you are trading, there should be opportunities to profit. tennis gives you defined risk rewards. the market has defined movements.

give us an example of a market you are trading, use your losses to learn what not to do.

you might think you are trading, but you might be gambling,

give us an example, then you can see what is going wrong. try to predict the next price , if you are wrong and if you are right.

tennis trader tool is useful .

also try to look at automation files, you can then see how you can make your trade profitable.

a mistake I used to make was to hold on to an idea which is a loss hoping it will turn.

try using offsets and stop losses tools.

cut your stakes until you become profitable, there is something going wrong, tennis is a money pit, you should be cleaning up.

try testing one idea at a time. then trading that.

- for example. the score is 15 / 30.

- the trainer being called on.

- the favourite losing first set.

just put in more work into testing,

[Euler]

I tend to enter the market when I think a break is more favourable and likely to occur, but I put a limit on how long that will be. So that could be in the next six games, end of set or similar. That's how I manage a Tennis position.

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=P ... 43D7D636EB

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P5x-tvW ... 43D7D636EB

[crazybass]

Thanks for all the helpful replies to my post. When I am using betangel in Tennis I use the ladder but only on the match odds market I have tended not to try any other market.

At the start of a match is when I do well but when it gets to the end of the match it's not so good. Where I have been successful I have been in and out on a couple of games and came out with a 10% return as minimum.

What happens then is I get bored and jump back in and that's when I have been making bad decisions and when it goes against me I have left it in there longer than I should have then I feel like point of no return.

I don't have sky sports or such and have been watching on kodi but the delay is really big however I have got into reading the ladder and when something has happened it seems very obvious.

Also with working 9 - 5 and kids in the house I rarely get on to my laptop before 9pm so I am limited really. I'm not wanting to get into trading in a big way I just get a buzz out of it... is that wrong...

Regards

[Dallas]

I never trade tennis markets without the 'Tennis Trader' tool, even without TV pics it is still possible to trade just using this tool, (in fact if i had to choose i'de trade with this rather than pics) An example of how to use it can be found in this thread
http://www.betangel.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=13251

Also the video tutorial links Euler posted above have several videos showing how best to use it.

Because its the score that move the price of each selection as the match progresses prices will move further with each point won/lost as they become more important so you can expect larger moves towards the end of a match especially if there playing a deciding set - another reason why Tennis Trader is invaluble for knowing your risk Vs rewards etc and were you should be looking to enter and exit.

[crazybass]

Sadly I don't have automation as I plumped for the trader version. Although after my trial on professional I did get an offer of discount on professional but I can't justify it to be honest. I was really just interested in one click and ladder. I had a glance at the links posted and will read more into them when I get a chance. I might also look into trading sets rather than match odds also.

Cheers

[Dallas]

Sadly I don't have automation as I plumped for the trader version. Although after my trial on professional I did get an offer of discount on professional but I can't justify it to be honest. I was really just interested in one click and ladder. I had a glance at the links posted and will read more into them when I get a chance. I might also look into trading sets rather than match odds also.

Cheers

Tennis trader is seperate from automation (although you do get both and much more with BA Pro) its also well worth getting into trading the games/sets etc rather than just picking random moments, i did once post details of how i traded the Aussie Open final earlier this year which will give you more of an idea about trading games/set around a break of serve
http://www.betangel.com/forum/viewtopic ... 7&start=61

Anyway hopefully this and other posters comments will give you a direction to go in

[crazybass]

Thanks Dallas that is most appreciated I didn't realise it was a separate application I'll look into it more but first I will have a read of your link.

[roger speakout]

if you have limited time, that is when professional is worth it.

you can always make 1 pound a day, it is like buying newspaper. etc. think about it this way, you want the best tools , because you are competing against people with bigger pockets and experience.

think about it, how much are you willing to invest to reach profitability quickly? it is a game on margins, I was tempted to right off my losses before it all clicked.

my advice is to invest in your trading, it is going to return to you in profits. I nearly quit because I did not understand small details. I wish I had spent money early, it would have accelerated my success.