Hi
I was trading the Epsom 19:35 race yesterday evening and had the video on as I was testing some indicators (which are just out of shot on the video)...The intention being that I could retrace my steps later that evening....I was logged in on Mode 1 (which automatically cancels the bets on suspension)..
You will notice from the following video I had £50 sitting out of the money
1.08 minutes into the video the market went into play but didn't cancel the £50 order..which got matched??
I was lucky that it turned out green in the end, but could equally have been a red
The video is here :-
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=19X79vtmp2k
I guess my question is: Can A market go straight to in-play bypassing suspension?? ..and why didnt my orders get cancelled??
Any ideas?
Thanks
Peter
What happened Here?..
-
andyfuller
- Posts: 4619
- Joined: Wed Mar 25, 2009 12:23 pm
You got matched in the SP reconciliation process. If you leave an order in the exchange BF assume you want matching. If you don't want to risk getting matched you need to cancel your orders before they suspend the market.
No.PeterLe wrote:Can A market go straight to in-play bypassing suspension??
They did - you will notice your lays were cancelled and your back order was matched as above.PeterLe wrote:why didnt my orders get cancelled??
Hi Andy,andyfuller wrote:You got matched in the SP reconciliation process. If you leave an order in the exchange BF assume you want matching. If you don't want to risk getting matched you need to cancel your orders before they suspend the market.
No.PeterLe wrote:Can A market go straight to in-play bypassing suspension??
They did - you will notice your lays were cancelled and your back order was matched as above.PeterLe wrote:why didnt my orders get cancelled??
In Mode 1, all bets (Back and Lay) should be cancelled shouldnt they at suspension (unless of course they have been modified to 'Keep", which is not possible in Mode 1)??
H LeTiss - It was like bloody Laurel and Hardy...! Good job I didnt have the sound on!
regards
Peter
-
andyfuller
- Posts: 4619
- Joined: Wed Mar 25, 2009 12:23 pm
It has nothing to do with Bet Angel.PeterLe wrote:In Mode 1, all bets (Back and Lay) should be cancelled shouldnt they at suspension (unless of course they have been modified to 'Keep", which is not possible in Mode 1)??
It goes like this:
1. The market is suspended
2. The SP is calculated (where your £50 back got matched)
3. All unmatched non Keep/Inplay bets are cancelled (where your £50 lay and little bit of the other lay that was left got cancelled)
4. The market goes inplay
I cancel all my orders before step 1 to avoid being matched like you in step 2
-
oddstrader
- Posts: 344
- Joined: Fri Apr 16, 2010 4:55 pm
PeterLe wrote:
why didnt my orders get cancelled??
They did get cancelled Peter its just your £50 back got hoovered up in the last millisecond.the SP answer from Andy is pretty much on the button.
Happens alot in quiet markets
why didnt my orders get cancelled??
They did get cancelled Peter its just your £50 back got hoovered up in the last millisecond.the SP answer from Andy is pretty much on the button.
Happens alot in quiet markets
Sorry Andy - I still dont agree with this (and I may be wrong)...andyfuller wrote:It has nothing to do with Bet Angel.PeterLe wrote:In Mode 1, all bets (Back and Lay) should be cancelled shouldnt they at suspension (unless of course they have been modified to 'Keep", which is not possible in Mode 1)??
It goes like this:
1. The market is suspended
2. The SP is calculated (where your £50 back got matched)
3. All unmatched non Keep/Inplay bets are cancelled (where your £50 lay and little bit of the other lay that was left got cancelled)
4. The market goes inplay
I cancel all my orders before step 1 to avoid being matched like you in step 2
The sequence you state above doesn't look right..at Step one ALL bets that are currently in the market are cancelled before the SP is initiated (unless you have takesp or KEEP bets).
At step 2, there should have been no bets in the market in my case.
I've just replayed this on slow motion and I think ODDS TRADER is correct. The £50 back at 5.4 got matched milliseconds before the suspension and the two lay bets were both cancelled at suspension.
I'm fairly sure about this as I often have hundreds on the back and lay side well out of the money and they always get cancelled at suspension??
regards
Peter
-
andyfuller
- Posts: 4619
- Joined: Wed Mar 25, 2009 12:23 pm
I am 99.9% sure it was matched in the SP process but without seeing the market status I can't be 100% sure - though I suspect if you panned out you would see the market was suspended when you were matched.
As Oddstrader said you could also get hoovered in the last few milliseconds. That has happened to me on ATR tracks where the horse has broken badly and the oncourse guys lay it before Betfair suspend the market.
You just have to compare the way Goodwood this week is turned inplay with say an ATR meeting and how it is suspended at the end of the race to see that the oncourse guys are able to see the start of the race sometimes before it goes inplay.
For that reason I try to always cancel all my orders as the last is loaded/as they come out.
As Oddstrader said you could also get hoovered in the last few milliseconds. That has happened to me on ATR tracks where the horse has broken badly and the oncourse guys lay it before Betfair suspend the market.
You just have to compare the way Goodwood this week is turned inplay with say an ATR meeting and how it is suspended at the end of the race to see that the oncourse guys are able to see the start of the race sometimes before it goes inplay.
For that reason I try to always cancel all my orders as the last is loaded/as they come out.
-
andyfuller
- Posts: 4619
- Joined: Wed Mar 25, 2009 12:23 pm
Well I will believe what I have read on the Betfair website and experienced since they brought in the Betfair SP and you believe what you think happensPeterLe wrote:Sorry Andy - I still dont agree with this (and I may be wrong)...
The sequence you state above doesn't look right..at Step one ALL bets that are currently in the market are cancelled before the SP is initiated (unless you have takesp or KEEP bets).
Well we will have to agree to disagree mate (I've just tested it again on the last two races and they def get cancelled! Try it using £2 stakes!)andyfuller wrote:Well I will believe what I have read on the Betfair website and experienced since they brought in the Betfair SP and you believe what you think happensPeterLe wrote:Sorry Andy - I still dont agree with this (and I may be wrong)...
The sequence you state above doesn't look right..at Step one ALL bets that are currently in the market are cancelled before the SP is initiated (unless you have takesp or KEEP bets).
-
andyfuller
- Posts: 4619
- Joined: Wed Mar 25, 2009 12:23 pm
I suggest you read the Betfair website about it rather than believing what you think you see is happening.
I have tried to help you understand it but there is no more I can do.
I have tried to help you understand it but there is no more I can do.
Hey Andy, I'm not having a go at you. I appreciate yours and everyones help on here; that's why I posted it.andyfuller wrote:I suggest you read the Betfair website about it rather than believing what you think you see is happening.
I have tried to help you understand it but there is no more I can do.
I've emailed Betfair for their comments.
regards
Peter
-
andyfuller
- Posts: 4619
- Joined: Wed Mar 25, 2009 12:23 pm
No offence is taken mate - I am happy to help but as I have said there is no more I can do to convince you. You are not understanding what is happening and what you think you are seeing is not what is actually happening - you need to go and spend some time reading about the BFSP and how they turn markets inplay as you currently are misleading yourself