Trading from South East Asia

[Bet Angel]

I just re-read that BDP document and it does seem to indicate you arrive in the UK first, so I stand corrected on that.

[andyfuller]

You use a VPS don't you Andy?

I have used one in the past. I found it very helpful when I was having issues with my local connection to Betfair. My internet connection was fine connecting to everything bar Betfair but connecting to Betfair I was regularly (I mean every 10 to 20 seconds) getting responses over 1000ms and sometimes 3,000ms+.

By connecting via a VPS so my Home PC was now connecting to the VPS and the VPS was the thing connecting to Betfair, I went back to getting good response times.

However, I switched ISP to Zen and that solved my connection issues with Betfair and improved my response times to about 60ms. Therefore I didn't see much need for adding in another step so stopped using the VPS as allowing 15ms for the VPS to Betfair that meant that my connection to the VPS from home needed to be 45ms to equal my direct connection from Home to Betfair but would gain no extra benefit so I saw no benefit in it and just increased risk by adding a further step and chance for something else to go wrong.

As I said at the start of the post though, when I was having connections issues it was a God send

I just re-read that BDP document and it does seem to indicate you arrive in the UK first, so I stand corrected on that.

It is a bit of an odd way they have of doing things but I assume it is to do with complying with something in their Bookmakers licence.

Just goes to show 10 years on and it is still possible to learn new things about trading on Betfair

[Bet Angel]

Just goes to show 10 years on and it is still possible to learn new things about trading on Betfair

You would have thought they would route it through Malta first as by looping it through the UK first you could argue that the operations are not in fact offshore, which is why they introduced the order routing in the first place!

[mctash]

Hi BA,

Please don't think i was slating it. I'm not. As you rightly say it has its uses. I merely sought to explain technical details to those having difficulty.

As I said using a vps will have a MAJOR speed impact on any operation that originates from the VPS. It's just that manual operations are still subject to the latency between your pc and the VPS.

Tash

[Bet Angel]

We have quite a few people that use VPS for many reasons, including using the spreadsheet and a VPS to trade in the background.

I use a VPS to trade Austrailian markets for the same reasons Austrailians may want to use a VPS to trade UK markets. But we are not recommending everybody buys one, just that its there as an option for people who want to benefit from the things it can bring.

[mctash]

Precisely BA, using a VPS with a response time of 15ms in those situations (automation at any level located on the vps) is going to give you a major speed advantage over average Joe connecting from his pc.

[andyfuller]

You would have thought they would route it through Malta first as by looping it through the UK first you could argue that the operations are not in fact offshore, which is why they introduced the order routing in the first place!

I agree it is an interesting point. From the BDP page it says:

"Your bet request from the UK to Betfair International in Malta
Bet request from Betfair International in Malta to the UK
Bet response (matched, unmatched, partially matched) from the UK to Betfair International in Malta
Your bet response from Betfair International to the UK
Your bet response from the UK to your location"

That would indicate that the Bet does not become Betfair's until it is received in Malta and thus until then it is still the Users. However, could it be argued that once Betfair UK receive it initially and handle it by sending it on to Malta it becomes their bet and not the Users?

If the fact that they handle it and thus it becomes their bet at that stage it would mean Betfair are liable for Levy on these bets placed on Horse Racing in the UK.

However, they are not stupid and as such I am sure they know what they are doing but I would say this is a much better area for the Levy Board/BHA to look at as opposed to chasing their tails with regards to Betfair as they are at the moment.

[ndtcbet]

andyfuller wrote:I have used one in the past. I found it very helpful when I was having issues with my local connection to Betfair. My internet connection was fine connecting to everything bar Betfair but connecting to Betfair I was regularly (I mean every 10 to 20 seconds) getting responses over 1000ms and sometimes 3,000ms+.
I experience this problem.May be, I should try a different ISP or using VPS again.

[ndtcbet]

To clarify my issue, I run a betfair performance test using betangel diagnostics, the result is:
2:51:47 PM : 390 ms
2:51:48 PM : 315 ms
2:51:48 PM : 311 ms
2:51:49 PM : 1318 ms
2:51:50 PM : 311 ms
2:51:50 PM : 311 ms
2:51:50 PM : 312 ms
2:51:51 PM : 312 ms
2:51:51 PM : 313 ms
2:51:51 PM : 310 ms
2:51:52 PM : 312 ms
2:51:52 PM : 311 ms
2:51:52 PM : 311 ms
2:51:52 PM : 311 ms
2:51:54 PM : 1316 ms
2:51:54 PM : 311 ms
2:51:54 PM : 311 ms
2:51:55 PM : 311 ms
2:51:55 PM : 311 ms
2:51:55 PM : 310 ms
2:51:56 PM : 311 ms
2:51:56 PM : 314 ms
2:51:56 PM : 312 ms
2:51:57 PM : 311 ms
2:51:57 PM : 314 ms
2:51:57 PM : 312 ms
2:51:59 PM : 1312 ms
2:51:59 PM : 311 ms
2:51:59 PM : 311 ms
2:51:59 PM : 311 ms
2:52:00 PM : 311 ms
2:52:00 PM : 310 ms
2:52:00 PM : 312 ms
2:52:01 PM : 312 ms
2:52:01 PM : 311 ms
2:52:01 PM : 311 ms
2:52:02 PM : 311 ms
2:52:03 PM : 1319 ms
2:52:03 PM : 311 ms
2:52:04 PM : 311 ms
2:52:04 PM : 311 ms
2:52:04 PM : 311 ms
2:52:05 PM : 311 ms
2:52:05 PM : 311 ms
2:52:05 PM : 312 ms
2:52:06 PM : 1312 ms
2:52:07 PM : 311 ms
2:52:07 PM : 312 ms
2:52:07 PM : 311 ms
2:52:08 PM : 310 ms
2:52:09 PM : 1317 ms
2:52:09 PM : 311 ms
2:52:10 PM : 313 ms
2:52:10 PM : 311 ms
2:52:10 PM : 311 ms
2:52:11 PM : 313 ms
2:52:11 PM : 311 ms
2:52:11 PM : 311 ms
2:52:12 PM : 312 ms
2:52:12 PM : 310 ms
2:52:12 PM : 311 ms
2:52:12 PM : 311 ms
2:52:13 PM : 312 ms
2:52:13 PM : 313 ms
2:52:13 PM : 311 ms
2:52:14 PM : 311 ms
2:52:14 PM : 311 ms
2:52:14 PM : 311 ms
2:52:15 PM : 312 ms
2:52:15 PM : 311 ms
2:52:15 PM : 311 ms
2:52:16 PM : 311 ms
2:52:17 PM : 1320 ms
2:52:17 PM : 312 ms
2:52:18 PM : 312 ms
2:52:18 PM : 311 ms
2:52:18 PM : 312 ms
2:52:18 PM : 311 ms
2:52:19 PM : 312 ms
2:52:19 PM : 313 ms
2:52:20 PM : 1319 ms
2:52:22 PM : 1323 ms
2:52:22 PM : 313 ms
2:52:23 PM : 1321 ms
2:52:24 PM : 312 ms
2:52:24 PM : 312 ms
2:52:24 PM : 312 ms
2:52:25 PM : 313 ms
2:52:25 PM : 312 ms
2:52:25 PM : 310 ms
2:52:26 PM : 312 ms
2:52:26 PM : 311 ms
2:52:26 PM : 311 ms
2:52:26 PM : 310 ms
2:52:27 PM : 311 ms
2:52:27 PM : 312 ms
2:52:27 PM : 312 ms
2:52:28 PM : 312 ms
2:52:28 PM : 310 ms
2:52:28 PM : 312 ms
2:52:29 PM : 312 ms
2:52:29 PM : 311 ms
2:52:29 PM : 311 ms
2:52:30 PM : 310 ms
2:52:30 PM : 313 ms
2:52:30 PM : 311 ms
2:52:31 PM : 311 ms
2:52:31 PM : 312 ms
2:52:31 PM : 312 ms
2:52:31 PM : 314 ms
2:52:32 PM : 311 ms
2:52:32 PM : 314 ms
2:52:32 PM : 312 ms
2:52:33 PM : 311 ms
2:52:33 PM : 310 ms
2:52:33 PM : 310 ms
2:52:34 PM : 313 ms
2:52:34 PM : 312 ms
2:52:34 PM : 311 ms
2:52:35 PM : 310 ms
2:52:35 PM : 312 ms
2:52:35 PM : 313 ms
2:52:36 PM : 312 ms
2:52:36 PM : 310 ms
2:52:36 PM : 312 ms
2:52:36 PM : 311 ms
2:52:37 PM : 311 ms
2:52:37 PM : 311 ms
2:52:37 PM : 311 ms
2:52:38 PM : 310 ms
2:52:38 PM : 312 ms
2:52:38 PM : 311 ms
2:52:39 PM : 311 ms
2:52:39 PM : 311 ms
2:52:39 PM : 312 ms
2:52:41 PM : 1320 ms
2:52:41 PM : 311 ms
2:52:41 PM : 310 ms
2:52:41 PM : 312 ms
2:52:42 PM : 314 ms
2:52:42 PM : 310 ms
2:52:42 PM : 312 ms
2:52:43 PM : 311 ms
2:52:43 PM : 311 ms
2:52:43 PM : 311 ms
2:52:44 PM : 311 ms
2:52:44 PM : 312 ms
2:52:44 PM : 310 ms
2:52:45 PM : 311 ms
2:52:46 PM : 1312 ms
2:52:46 PM : 311 ms
2:52:47 PM : 312 ms
2:52:47 PM : 310 ms
2:52:48 PM : 1317 ms
2:52:48 PM : 311 ms
2:52:50 PM : 1319 ms
2:52:50 PM : 311 ms
2:52:50 PM : 315 ms
2:52:51 PM : 311 ms
2:52:51 PM : 311 ms
2:52:51 PM : 311 ms
2:52:52 PM : 311 ms
2:52:52 PM : 311 ms
2:52:52 PM : 312 ms
2:52:53 PM : 310 ms
2:52:53 PM : 312 ms
2:52:53 PM : 313 ms
2:52:54 PM : 310 ms
2:52:54 PM : 312 ms
2:52:54 PM : 313 ms
2:52:54 PM : 311 ms
2:52:55 PM : 311 ms
2:52:55 PM : 311 ms
2:52:55 PM : 311 ms
2:52:56 PM : 311 ms
2:52:56 PM : 311 ms
2:52:56 PM : 312 ms
2:52:57 PM : 312 ms
2:52:57 PM : 311 ms
2:52:57 PM : 311 ms
2:52:58 PM : 314 ms
2:52:58 PM : 312 ms
2:52:59 PM : 1321 ms
2:53:00 PM : 354 ms
2:53:00 PM : 312 ms
2:53:00 PM : 312 ms
2:53:01 PM : 312 ms
2:53:01 PM : 312 ms
2:53:01 PM : 312 ms
2:53:01 PM : 311 ms
2:53:02 PM : 312 ms
2:53:02 PM : 312 ms
2:53:03 PM : 1320 ms
2:53:04 PM : 312 ms
2:53:05 PM : 1318 ms
2:53:05 PM : 312 ms
2:53:06 PM : 313 ms
2:53:06 PM : 311 ms
2:53:06 PM : 311 ms
2:53:07 PM : 312 ms
2:53:07 PM : 311 ms
2:53:07 PM : 313 ms
2:53:08 PM : 311 ms
2:53:08 PM : 312 ms
2:53:08 PM : 311 ms
2:53:08 PM : 312 ms
2:53:09 PM : 313 ms
2:53:09 PM : 312 ms
2:53:09 PM : 311 ms
2:53:10 PM : 312 ms
2:53:10 PM : 311 ms
2:53:10 PM : 311 ms
2:53:11 PM : 311 ms
2:53:11 PM : 312 ms
2:53:11 PM : 313 ms
2:53:12 PM : 312 ms
2:53:12 PM : 311 ms
2:53:12 PM : 312 ms
2:53:13 PM : 312 ms
2:53:13 PM : 313 ms
2:53:13 PM : 312 ms
2:53:13 PM : 311 ms
2:53:14 PM : 316 ms
2:53:14 PM : 320 ms
2:53:14 PM : 310 ms
2:53:15 PM : 312 ms
2:53:15 PM : 311 ms
2:53:15 PM : 312 ms
2:53:16 PM : 311 ms
2:53:16 PM : 312 ms
2:53:16 PM : 312 ms
2:53:17 PM : 311 ms
2:53:17 PM : 313 ms
2:53:17 PM : 312 ms
2:53:18 PM : 313 ms
2:53:18 PM : 312 ms
2:53:18 PM : 311 ms
2:53:18 PM : 311 ms
2:53:19 PM : 311 ms
2:53:19 PM : 312 ms
2:53:19 PM : 314 ms
2:53:20 PM : 312 ms
2:53:20 PM : 311 ms
2:53:20 PM : 312 ms
2:53:21 PM : 312 ms
2:53:21 PM : 312 ms
2:53:21 PM : 313 ms
2:53:22 PM : 310 ms
2:53:22 PM : 312 ms
2:53:22 PM : 312 ms
2:53:26 PM : 3328 ms
2:53:26 PM : 312 ms
2:53:26 PM : 313 ms
2:53:26 PM : 312 ms
2:53:27 PM : 311 ms
2:53:27 PM : 314 ms
2:53:27 PM : 312 ms
2:53:28 PM : 313 ms
2:53:28 PM : 311 ms
2:53:28 PM : 311 ms
2:53:29 PM : 312 ms
2:53:29 PM : 312 ms
2:53:29 PM : 314 ms
2:53:30 PM : 312 ms
2:53:31 PM : 1321 ms
2:53:31 PM : 312 ms
2:53:32 PM : 312 ms
2:53:32 PM : 311 ms
2:53:32 PM : 312 ms
2:53:32 PM : 313 ms
2:53:33 PM : 312 ms
2:53:33 PM : 313 ms
2:53:34 PM : 1314 ms
2:53:35 PM : 312 ms
2:53:35 PM : 311 ms
2:53:35 PM : 312 ms
2:53:36 PM : 312 ms
2:53:37 PM : 1314 ms
2:53:37 PM : 312 ms
2:53:38 PM : 312 ms
2:53:38 PM : 312 ms
2:53:38 PM : 311 ms
2:53:39 PM : 310 ms
2:53:39 PM : 313 ms

As you can see that, about every 5s I got a very poor response time up to 1300ms, that make me impossible to trade. Is there any one else experience the same problem?. Any more suggestion?. By the way ,I appreciate the info all you guys gave me about BF,VPS.

[Bet Angel]

How about a test, we can give you temporary access and lets see what difference it makes.

[ndtcbet]

To BEtangel:
Sory I dont understand, do you mean you let me try VPS?.

[Bet Angel]

Yes, I think it would be quite an interesting experiment. Please contact support and we will set one up for a few days.

[ndtcbet]

Thank guy!

I just sign another contract with a new ISP. I plan to keep 2 connection at once to experiment with the VPS. The new connection will be ready for about a week. When It's ready I may contact betangel support for temporary access to VPS to see any different. Thank guy at the Betangel Support!.

[Joao]

I'm in Portugal, will I feel any major difference if I use the VPS?

Thanks!

EDIT: Would a VPS located in malta be better for international traders?

[aligammack]

As an international trader I was recently advised to try another trading platform which seemed much faster than BetAngel. It felt like BA on VPS but without the VPS.

How is this possible? Will response times on future versions of BA get faster?

I would just like to add that while trying this I actually lost money and I put that down to missing the advance charting.