Tax on winnings in Australia

[megarain]

Curious as to how Aussie residents handle the tax liability on winnings from Bf.

Do u just declare u have won X, and pay some tax after expenses, or keep quiet and hope for the best ?

Anyone ever had grief from Tax man ?

[Naffman]

It's not taxable so the same as UK

[megarain]

Oh, when did that change ?

I need to keep up ... good news

[Naffman]

Oh, when did that change ?

I need to keep up ... good news

Think it's always been like that, last 10 years at least anyhow, but yes for all their nanny laws it is quite surprising

[Kai]

nanny laws

I assume the visa situation for "gambling immigrants" is worse compared to the UK then?

Surprised to see Australia having higher standards of living etc compared to UK, higher salaries too, thought it was the other way around.

[gazuty]

nanny laws

I assume the visa situation for "gambling immigrants" is worse compared to the UK then?

Surprised to see Australia having higher standards of living etc compared to UK, higher salaries too, thought it was the other way around.

Australia is a high wage, high tax, high cost society with a reasonable safety net.

[Dr_Zoidberg]

Generally not taxable as it would create a situation where gambling losses could be offset against income, creating a huge nett loss for the government.

You can apply for what is called a private tax ruling from the Australian Tax Office which is legally binding provided your circumstances do not materially change. There have been isolated cases where the ATO have pursued the large syndicates for alleged tax debts (ZR and Walsh being the most notable) but all of these have settled before any sort of judicial intervention. The advice I've received is that the ATO would almost certainly have lost but they pursue the 'debts' in the knowledge that it's much cheaper to settle than defend. We are talking about syndicates with literally hundreds of members/employees, a Betfair trader operating independently isn't going to have any tax issues.

[Dr_Zoidberg]

https://www.theadvocate.com.au/story/40 ... -tax-debt/

[megarain]

Thx - all good info

[Kai]

There have been isolated cases where the ATO have pursued the large syndicates for alleged tax debts (ZR and Walsh being the most notable) but all of these have settled before any sort of judicial intervention.

I did read somewhere that the Croatian Zeljko Ranogajec (ZR like you say ) had issues with ATO but hard to know for sure because he's so extremely private. But if arguably the worlds biggest billionaire gambler chose Australia to operate from that says a lot about the country itself and its potential, it's probably the maximum a gambler can do to realize that potential tbh.

I'm sure the weather is far nicer compared to UK, but I'm looking at the timezones now and they seem a disaster if trading the UK markets, must be a major PITA for Aussies.

[spreadbetting]

https://www.theadvocate.com.au/story/40 ... -tax-debt/

This was not so, the Tax Office claimed, with the punters' club setting up three companies after receiving advice in 1999 that to operate the software personally might be construed as an "indicium of a business".

I'd guess many of the bigger Betfair winners all have software running 24/7

[ShaunWhite]

There have been isolated cases where the ATO have pursued the large syndicates for alleged tax debts (ZR and Walsh being the most notable) but all of these have settled before any sort of judicial intervention.

I did read somewhere that the Croatian Zeljko Ranogajec (ZR like you say ) had issues with ATO but hard to know for sure because he's so extremely private.

ZR. https://www.smh.com.au/national/meet-th ... 4zfhi.html

And this was a really good interview with Walsh.
https://www.afr.com/opinion/david-walsh ... 1214-ij8gn

[Kai]

There have been isolated cases where the ATO have pursued the large syndicates for alleged tax debts (ZR and Walsh being the most notable) but all of these have settled before any sort of judicial intervention.

I did read somewhere that the Croatian Zeljko Ranogajec (ZR like you say ) had issues with ATO but hard to know for sure because he's so extremely private.

ZR. https://www.smh.com.au/national/meet-th ... 4zfhi.html

And this was a really good interview with Walsh.
https://www.afr.com/opinion/david-walsh ... 1214-ij8gn

Cheers Shaun, interesting stuff, particularly about Zeljko moving his HQ to the Isle of Man. Don't know much about him, other than he's mainly interested in horse racing and making at least a billion per year. Perhaps a hint where most value can be found in gambling overall. Walsh seems an interesting character as well.

[ShaunWhite]

I like David Walch's attitude to life and luck.

[Kai]

I like David Walch's attitude to life and luck.

Yup, spot on with the survivorship bias as well.

Interesting bit about Betfair having 30k winners out of 800k customers several years ago, which is far more than he could predict. I like how humble he is despite all the success, by openly admitting that there are ways to win that he's not even privy to.