Forums getting quieter

[alexmr2]

Last year there was a post about declining liquidity year-on-year... it feels like the forum is getting quieter recently and I've saw a couple of other people mention the same. The general BF forum seems to be 99% mug chat and another BF trading forum seems to have been active many years ago, only to die off almost completely in the last couple of years.

This doesn't make sense to me as I would have assumed that over time more people would coming into the BF trading world year-on-year, especially from the 2018-present boom in matched betting. I would have thought that there would be a lot more people looking for ways to make an income online in general and that many punters would have wisened up to how the exchange/trading offers better value.

Could it be that 10 years ago the casual punter with ladders could easily pick up an edge from the markets with enough money to go around all the software traders more evenly... which lead to many happy people coming online to discuss and set up challenges? As opposed to now when only the well-practiced traders and bots are taking most of the money from the markets? Thus any newbie doesn't stand much of a chance to last long enough and participate in a forum community? I'm not so sure that explains it though as profitability always feels like it's just round the corner and people like me will keep trying again and again as well as coming on here to try and learn more.

Alternatively people did get smarter and realised that they have nothing to gain by posting but everything to gain by reading the forum

Obviously there are still people making a lot of money from this but it sort of feels like a dying, or at least less active industry than 5-10 years ago

What are your thoughts?

[ikky]

I think the general help about automation has increased - but sure, many markets are seeing falling liquidity, and probably more
professionals trading against each other.

No one these days is going to say he's making a killing in the 'Bandy' side markets, as they probably have limited liquidity, and will only attract
competition.

For kids starting out, who have no automation skills, its probably more difficult to win - but maybe
they can more accurately price Esports.

[PapaShango]

I tend to agree with you , Alex. It does feel that way.

I think there are a few factors at play. All the uncertainty about what the gambling review will bring isn’t helping. All the premature shutting of accounts and intrusive affordability checks aren’t helping.

A lot of the chat on here does all seem to be about automation and bots. Which if you have no knowledge or interest in, it’s not really something you can comment on or add to the debate.

As for new people coming through, I suppose they have more options now. Crypto , nft and stocks etc must seem a lot more lucrative than sports betting to newcomers starting out. Especially with all the tales of how hard sports trading is, compared to crypto where everybody is seemingly a winner.


My own views on forums is that social media and Twitter etc have unfortunately taken them over. Back in the day, the aforementioned betfair forum was the place to be. Everybody who was anybody used to post in there, and also on various blogs etc. People were a lot more forthcoming and sharing with their knowledge back then. You could learn a lot more back then from the forums and blogs than you can now. Unfortunately now, everything has been monetised. Back then, people were just genuinely enthused, and were sharing their knowledge and enthusiasm for free.

This is the last remaining decent uk trading/betting forum left on the internet. It’s a credit to the owners how they have kept it going for so long.

[napshnap]

"Robinhood" like apps are sucking out "new blood" from betting/trading sports. And the fact that n america is still closed for international betting industry doesn't help too.

[Derek27]

It's the time of year, racing's quiet, people are bracing themselves for imminent nuclear war, and you're worried about exchange liquidity.

[jimibt]

I tend to agree with you , Alex. It does feel that way.

As for new people coming through, I suppose they have more options now. Crypto , nft and stocks etc must seem a lot more lucrative than sports betting to newcomers starting out. Especially with all the tales of how hard sports trading is, compared to crypto where everybody is seemingly a winner.

as someone that made that transition from BF->Crypto, I do think it offers better, more scalable opportunities. For those that know me, i spent 6-7 years doing BF via BA and very much enjoyed mixing BA with my own betfair api integrations. I didn't slide away due to liquidity issues etc, for me it was more that my son alerted me to the space and it kinda just took hold from there. lots of good api integration from the main exchanges (kucoin, binance, gate.io etc), so there really is a plethora of choice. couple that with 1% transaction fees and you can see the (growing) attraction.

[edit] - interestingly, quite a few of the ideas formulated during my BF period have proved to be quite useful in the crypto space (some, not all i hasten to add!)

[PapaShango]

I tend to agree with you , Alex. It does feel that way.

As for new people coming through, I suppose they have more options now. Crypto , nft and stocks etc must seem a lot more lucrative than sports betting to newcomers starting out. Especially with all the tales of how hard sports trading is, compared to crypto where everybody is seemingly a winner.

as someone that made that transition from BF->Crypto, I do think it offers better, more scalable opportunities. For those that know me, i spent 6-7 years doing BF via BA and very much enjoyed mixing BA with my own betfair api integrations. I didn't slide away due to liquidity issues etc, for me it was more that my son alerted me to the space and it kinda just took hold from there. lots of good api integration from the main exchanges (kucoin, binance, gate.io etc), so there really is a plethora of choice. couple that with 1% transaction fees and you can see the (growing) attraction.

[edit] - interestingly, quite a few of the ideas formulated during my BF period has proved to be quite useful in the crypto space (some, not all i hasten to add!)

Fair play to you Jimibt. Sounds like you're doing well.

I dont understand crypto one bit. I just don't understand where all the money comes from ? Seems to be a lot of big winners, but no big losers. Where are the crypto related suicides ? Who are the crypto Mersons ? Where does all the sponsorship, CEOs Salarys , wages, money spent on advertising etc come from ?

I understand where it comes from in sports betting. I just don't see where it comes from in crypto, everyone just seems to be winning and spending .

[Euler]

New money is minted (mined) out of thin air on Crypto's. I can understand the appeal from a trading perspective. But I'd imagine most youngster in this space don't really fully understand what they are getting into and will eventually end up losing a fair amount of money.

[jimibt]

I tend to agree with you , Alex. It does feel that way.

As for new people coming through, I suppose they have more options now. Crypto , nft and stocks etc must seem a lot more lucrative than sports betting to newcomers starting out. Especially with all the tales of how hard sports trading is, compared to crypto where everybody is seemingly a winner.

as someone that made that transition from BF->Crypto, I do think it offers better, more scalable opportunities. For those that know me, i spent 6-7 years doing BF via BA and very much enjoyed mixing BA with my own betfair api integrations. I didn't slide away due to liquidity issues etc, for me it was more that my son alerted me to the space and it kinda just took hold from there. lots of good api integration from the main exchanges (kucoin, binance, gate.io etc), so there really is a plethora of choice. couple that with 1% transaction fees and you can see the (growing) attraction.

[edit] - interestingly, quite a few of the ideas formulated during my BF period has proved to be quite useful in the crypto space (some, not all i hasten to add!)

Fair play to you Jimibt. Sounds like you're doing well.

I dont understand crypto one bit. I just don't understand where all the money comes from ? Seems to be a lot of big winners, but no big losers. Where are the crypto related suicides ? Who are the crypto Mersons ? Where does all the sponsorship, CEOs Salarys , wages, money spent on advertising etc come from ?

I understand where it comes from in sports betting. I just don't see where it comes from in crypto, everyone just seems to be winning and spending .

i've managed to find a few small niches - however, like BF, edges don't last forever, so there is a need to always be looking thro the data and trying to find new angles. one that i'm currently exploring is effectively trying to hussle in on a pump 'n dump scheme. this is where a group collectively push the price of an anonymous coin at a predetermined point in time. the coin is announced via Discord. Everyone then piles in. I've optimised this to use a mix of http scanning plus the api to identify this message going up and then activate the api to buy and sell the coin inside a 8-10 second timewindow. still a wip but one of the many ways that you need to remain inventive.

my main activity however, is based on looking at the candles (1m, 5m 15m) across all coins and finding patterns that translate to known technical indicators. this is also a wip and is somewhat less energetic than the pump 'n dump but has a fairly reliable outcome

as for where the money comes from and goes to.. that's a tale for another day i guess.

[PapaShango]

To be honest Jimibt, that sounds dodgy as f**k to me. But good luck to you!

I still think that one day something will happen, and all those exchanges, which nobody monitors or regulates, will go offline, panic will ensue, nobody will be able to withdraw anything, and some people who got caught out at the wrong time will finally face some significant losses.

Though God knows when that will be.

[Trader Pat]

Though God knows when that will be.

Probably when China says so

[jimibt]

To be honest Jimibt, that sounds dodgy as f**k to me. But good luck to you!

I still think that one day something will happen, and all those exchanges, which nobody monitors or regulates, will go offline, panic will ensue, nobody will be able to withdraw anything, and some people who got caught out at the wrong time will finally face some significant losses.

Though God knows when that will be.

yeah -that particular *strategy* is well dodgy and is really just me exploring the art of the possible

[Dim]

"Alternatively people did get smarter"...

Well, just look at TikTok, no sign of people getting smarter.

[alexmr2]

My own views on forums is that social media and Twitter etc have unfortunately taken them over.

Very good point. I also noticed this when I was in a car owners club forum and over the last few years it started to die off as FB groups grew.

Unfortunately I've found that most trading groups seem to be full of mug chat with very few useful comments or discussion

[Tetras]

My own views on forums is that social media and Twitter etc have unfortunately taken them over.

Very good point. I also noticed this when I was in a car owners club forum and over the last few years it started to die off as FB groups grew.

Unfortunately I've found that most trading groups seem to be full of mug chat with very few useful comments or discussion

A lot of the places I frequented seem to use Discord and telegram.