Offset Bet with Greening & Stop Issue

[delghisallo]

Hi All,

I have an automated rule that places a back bet on a selected horse, with an offset bet with greening and a stop. Very occasionally the rule doesn't appear to place the lay bet (ie the greening or stop) into the market. What would be the reason for this?

thanks

Delghisallo

[delghisallo]

Here is the log of such an example...... No Lay bet was placed on Shortcross Storm (Ref: 265604829164)

1/04/2022 15:24:25: [G_Auto 1] : Store Text Value for One For Billy: Horse = One For Billy
21/04/2022 15:24:25: [G_Auto 1] : Store Text Value for Turning Gold: Horse = Turning Gold
21/04/2022 15:24:25: [G_Auto 1] : Store Text Value for Shortcross Storm: Horse = Shortcross Storm
21/04/2022 15:24:30: [G_Auto 1] : £ 1.00 Back bet placed on Shortcross Storm at 4.8. Fully matched at 4.8. Ref: 265604828468 ( Offsetting by 15 ticks with greening. Stop at 8 ticks. Place stop at 12 ticks )
21/04/2022 15:24:30: [G_Auto 1] : £ 1.00 Back bet placed on Turning Gold at 6. Fully matched at 6. Ref: 265604828428 ( Offsetting by 15 ticks with greening. Stop at 8 ticks. Place stop at 12 ticks )
21/04/2022 15:24:30: [G_Auto 1] : £ 1.32 Lay bet placed on Shortcross Storm at 3.65. Entirely unmatched when it initially reached the market. Ref: 265604829164
21/04/2022 15:24:30: [G_Auto 1] : £ 1.33 Lay bet placed on Turning Gold at 4.5. Entirely unmatched when it initially reached the market. Ref: 265604829163
21/04/2022 15:24:40: [G_Auto 1] : Modify bet persistence 265604829163 from 'Cancel' to 'Keep'

21/04/2022 15:24:40: [G_Auto 1] : Modify bet persistence 265604829164 from 'Cancel' to 'Keep'


21/04/2022 15:25:11: Guardian has detected that the market is suspended
21/04/2022 15:25:12: Guardian has detected that the market is in-play
21/04/2022 15:25:13: Guardian has detected that the market is now unsuspended
21/04/2022 15:25:19: Stop triggered. Modify bet 265604829163 from 1.33 @ 4.5 to 0.79 @ 8.4 [Keep at in-play] New Ref: 265604939636
21/04/2022 15:26:28: Stop triggered. Modify bet 265604829164 from 1.32 @ 3.65 to 0.86 @ 6 [Keep at in-play] New Ref: 265605069153
21/04/2022 15:29:05: Guardian has detected that the market is suspended

[Dallas]

The log shows the stop was triggered and placed at 6.0?

[delghisallo]

The log shows the stop was triggered and placed at 6.0?

Thanks Dallas,

In your experiance do you know of any reason why this lay bet wouldnt have pushed through to betfair? Attached are the screenshots for me betfair account for that race......

Screenshot 2022-04-22 at 17.43.24.png

Screenshot 2022-04-22 at 17.47.17.png

as mentioned in my earlier post, I appear to get this issue once or twice a week

regards

Delghisallo

[ShaunWhite]

The log shows the stop was triggered and placed at 6.0?

Thanks Dallas,

In your experiance do you know of any reason why this lay bet wouldnt have pushed through to betfair? Attached are the screenshots for me betfair account for that race......

Screenshot 2022-04-22 at 17.43.24.png

Screenshot 2022-04-22 at 17.47.17.png

as mentioned in my earlier post, I appear to get this issue once or twice a week

regards

Delghisallo

The log agrees with the betfair info. There's a couple of unmatched bets in the log, what do you think is missing?

[delghisallo]

The log shows the stop was triggered and placed at 6.0?

Thanks Dallas,

In your experiance do you know of any reason why this lay bet wouldnt have pushed through to betfair? Attached are the screenshots for me betfair account for that race......

Screenshot 2022-04-22 at 17.43.24.png

Screenshot 2022-04-22 at 17.47.17.png

as mentioned in my earlier post, I appear to get this issue once or twice a week

regards

Delghisallo

The log agrees with the betfair info. There's a couple of unmatched bets in the log, what do you think is missing?

Hi Shaun,

As the rule sets a lay bet either to green up or a stop to limit a losing trade I would have expected in my betfair account to see this lay bet, but only see the back bet. The strange thing is, as Dallas highlighted, the automation did trigger a stop at odds of 6...I'm confused (this is quite common though to be honest )

Regards

Delghisallo

[delghisallo]

Hi Dallas or Shaun,

thanks for your comments so far, could there be any reason within my rule that means that Bet Angel is registering the lay bet in the log and not pushing the bet through to betfair? It is strange, but I've had same thing happen multiple times now

thanks

Delghisallo

[ShaunWhite]

Hi Dallas or Shaun,

thanks for your comments so far, could there be any reason within my rule that means that Bet Angel is registering the lay bet in the log and not pushing the bet through to betfair? It is strange, but I've had same thing happen multiple times now

thanks

Delghisallo

Do you think it could be that your bet just isn't getting matched? It would show on Betfair as unmatched while the market is still open but once it's closed they'll disappear from your transaction history and it'll look like they were never placed. Are these missing lay bets on losers?

[firlandsfarm]

Here is the log of such an example......
21/04/2022 15:24:30: [G_Auto 1] : £ 1.33 Lay bet placed on Turning Gold at 4.5. Entirely unmatched when it initially reached the market. Ref: 265604829163
21/04/2022 15:24:40: [G_Auto 1] : Modify bet persistence 265604829163 from 'Cancel' to 'Keep'

21/04/2022 15:25:19: Stop triggered. Modify bet 265604829163 from 1.33 @ 4.5 to 0.79 @ 8.4 [Keep at in-play] New Ref: 265604939636

Hi Dallas, this thread raises a question that I have always avoided in my rules files! I have always assumed that the offset (or stop if using) bet would be placed using the default "Cancel" at the off but this log seems to suggest that they would inherit the status of the initial bet (Keep in this instance). Have I been creating difficulties for myself all these years!

[Dallas]

Here is the log of such an example......
21/04/2022 15:24:30: [G_Auto 1] : £ 1.33 Lay bet placed on Turning Gold at 4.5. Entirely unmatched when it initially reached the market. Ref: 265604829163
21/04/2022 15:24:40: [G_Auto 1] : Modify bet persistence 265604829163 from 'Cancel' to 'Keep'

21/04/2022 15:25:19: Stop triggered. Modify bet 265604829163 from 1.33 @ 4.5 to 0.79 @ 8.4 [Keep at in-play] New Ref: 265604939636

Hi Dallas, this thread raises a question that I have always avoided in my rules files! I have always assumed that the offset (or stop if using) bet would be placed using the default "Cancel" at the off but this log seems to suggest that they would inherit the status of the initial bet (Keep in this instance). Have I been creating difficulties for myself all these years!

It depends on whether the bet is in the market or not when the keep bet rule triggers

In that log the lay bet (offset bet) was already in the market before the keep unmatched bets rule fired so would be kept

Had the offset been triggered after the keep unmatched bet rule it would be cancelled at the off (unless the keep unmatched bets rule was triggered again)

[firlandsfarm]

Here is the log of such an example......
21/04/2022 15:24:30: [G_Auto 1] : £ 1.33 Lay bet placed on Turning Gold at 4.5. Entirely unmatched when it initially reached the market. Ref: 265604829163
21/04/2022 15:24:40: [G_Auto 1] : Modify bet persistence 265604829163 from 'Cancel' to 'Keep'

21/04/2022 15:25:19: Stop triggered. Modify bet 265604829163 from 1.33 @ 4.5 to 0.79 @ 8.4 [Keep at in-play] New Ref: 265604939636

Hi Dallas, this thread raises a question that I have always avoided in my rules files! I have always assumed that the offset (or stop if using) bet would be placed using the default "Cancel" at the off but this log seems to suggest that they would inherit the status of the initial bet (Keep in this instance). Have I been creating difficulties for myself all these years!

It depends on whether the bet is in the market or not when the keep bet rule triggers

In that log the lay bet (offset bet) was already in the market before the keep unmatched bets rule fired so would be kept

Had the offset been triggered after the keep unmatched bet rule it would be cancelled at the off (unless the keep unmatched bets rule was triggered again)

OK ... I think!

What I'm trying to ascertain is whether the follow-on bet (offset or stop), the child bet, acquires the same "At in-play" status as the original bet, the parent bet. I simply wasn't aware that if the parent bet was set to say "Take SP" when it was matched (or breached the Stop) then the Offset or Stop child bet would inherit that same "Take SP" status. Is that correct?

[Dallas]

Hi Dallas, this thread raises a question that I have always avoided in my rules files! I have always assumed that the offset (or stop if using) bet would be placed using the default "Cancel" at the off but this log seems to suggest that they would inherit the status of the initial bet (Keep in this instance). Have I been creating difficulties for myself all these years!

It depends on whether the bet is in the market or not when the keep bet rule triggers

In that log the lay bet (offset bet) was already in the market before the keep unmatched bets rule fired so would be kept

Had the offset been triggered after the keep unmatched bet rule it would be cancelled at the off (unless the keep unmatched bets rule was triggered again)

OK ... I think!

What I'm trying to ascertain is whether the follow-on bet (offset or stop), the child bet, acquires the same "At in-play" status as the original bet, the parent bet. I simply wasn't aware that if the parent bet was set to say "Take SP" when it was matched (or breached the Stop) then the Offset or Stop child bet would inherit that same "Take SP" status. Is that correct?

No it doesn't, the offset bet when placed will be given its own bet ID from Betfair so that will require a take SP/keep bets rule to trigger again once its been placed

[delghisallo]

Hi Dallas or Shaun,

thanks for your comments so far, could there be any reason within my rule that means that Bet Angel is registering the lay bet in the log and not pushing the bet through to betfair? It is strange, but I've had same thing happen multiple times now

thanks

Delghisallo

Do you think it could be that your bet just isn't getting matched? It would show on Betfair as unmatched while the market is still open but once it's closed they'll disappear from your transaction history and it'll look like they were never placed. Are these missing lay bets on losers?

I think you might be right Shaun, thanks, it sounds very feasible that the lay bet isnt unmatched as maybe the market moved too quick. Yes these would be typically lay bets on losers, as the issue appears to always happen when I am stopped out. Would there be anyway to mitigate this issue with automation

thanks Delghisallo

[firlandsfarm]

It depends on whether the bet is in the market or not when the keep bet rule triggers

In that log the lay bet (offset bet) was already in the market before the keep unmatched bets rule fired so would be kept

Had the offset been triggered after the keep unmatched bet rule it would be cancelled at the off (unless the keep unmatched bets rule was triggered again)

OK ... I think!

What I'm trying to ascertain is whether the follow-on bet (offset or stop), the child bet, acquires the same "At in-play" status as the original bet, the parent bet. I simply wasn't aware that if the parent bet was set to say "Take SP" when it was matched (or breached the Stop) then the Offset or Stop child bet would inherit that same "Take SP" status. Is that correct?

No it doesn't, the offset bet when placed will be given its own bet ID from Betfair so that will require a take SP/keep bets rule to trigger again once its been placed

I didn't think it did either but in the log when bet ...164 is modified it confirms the new odds/stake and then states "[Keep at in-play]". I thought that was saying the new bet would Keep! As I said before I have always managed rules that it doesn't Keep but this thread just caused me a little doubt! Thanks for confirming

[Dallas]

OK ... I think!

What I'm trying to ascertain is whether the follow-on bet (offset or stop), the child bet, acquires the same "At in-play" status as the original bet, the parent bet. I simply wasn't aware that if the parent bet was set to say "Take SP" when it was matched (or breached the Stop) then the Offset or Stop child bet would inherit that same "Take SP" status. Is that correct?

No it doesn't, the offset bet when placed will be given its own bet ID from Betfair so that will require a take SP/keep bets rule to trigger again once its been placed

I didn't think it did either but in the log when bet ...164 is modified it confirms the new odds/stake and then states "[Keep at in-play]". I thought that was saying the new bet would Keep! As I said before I have always managed rules that it doesn't Keep but this thread just caused me a little doubt! Thanks for confirming

That bet would be kept because its already been marked to keep, and is just being repriced

Just the same as if you manually placed at bet, clicked keep unmatched, then dragged it to a new price, it would still be kept without needing to click the keep unmatched bet button again