Ukraine Crisis

[Kai]

I think maybe Firlandsfarm was a teenager back then?

Not sure where I came into this nor how my age then is relevant ... but to settle any doubts, I didn't do it, honest! And I wasn't.

Apologies for my terrible maths then

Was simply hoping you could compare the two crises and put old Worryguts' mind at ease there!

[Michael5482]

British Army could be wiped out after six months in a major war, minister says.......

Official figures indicate 109,245 personnel were serving in the British Army on October 1......

Since 2018, when figures were first recorded, more than 147,800 people have arrived on small boats....

Draw your own conclusions

If we fought Russia on our own then he may have a point but we'd be fighting with allies so the rate of attrition would be a lot less, he also doesn't take into account our training, ability, weapons capability v that of an enemy, air superiority/support, naval support, logistics, basically he's said Ukraine/Russia loose x amount of troops per day then divided that by our forces number and came to a number of days/months that we'd last.

That's the problem with politicians they come out with all this stuff, offer nothing to back it up then come up with no plan to sort it out probably because they are not competent enough to fully identify the problem in the 1st place let alone resolve it.

It's not exactly motivational to our serving troops for a minster to come out and say you'll be wiped out in 6 months if we went to war, can't see anyone breaking there necks to sign up to serve on the back of it either. Personally I think the said minister is a f@ckin idiot, Royal Marine or not.

[ForFolksSake]

British Army could be wiped out after six months in a major war, minister says.......

Official figures indicate 109,245 personnel were serving in the British Army on October 1......

Since 2018, when figures were first recorded, more than 147,800 people have arrived on small boats....

Draw your own conclusions

If we fought Russia on our own then he may have a point but we'd be fighting with allies so the rate of attrition would be a lot less, he also doesn't take into account our training, ability, weapons capability v that of an enemy, air superiority/support, naval support, logistics, basically he's said Ukraine/Russia loose x amount of troops per day then divided that by our forces number and came to a number of days/months that we'd last.

That's the problem with politicians they come out with all this stuff, offer nothing to back it up then come up with no plan to sort it out probably because they are not competent enough to fully identify the problem in the 1st place let alone resolve it.

It's not exactly motivational to our serving troops for a minster to come out and say you'll be wiped out in 6 months if we went to war, can't see anyone breaking there necks to sign up to serve on the back of it either. Personally I think the said minister is a f@ckin idiot, Royal Marine or not.

Bit of a whistle blower... and we all know what happens to them.
He'll be alright though - public sector pension for life

https://youtu.be/-Gz6mZYxS0A

Useless twats - the lot of them - here one day gone the next

[firlandsfarm]

I think maybe Firlandsfarm was a teenager back then?

Not sure where I came into this nor how my age then is relevant ... but to settle any doubts, I didn't do it, honest! And I wasn't.

Was simply hoping you could compare the two crises and put old Worryguts' mind at ease there!

[ForFolksSake]

‘Negligent to point of STUPIDITY!’: Ex-soldier warns ‘Russia sees itself as at war with Britain’ as he tears into Labour defence spend

The Labour government has committed to raising UK defence spending to 2.5% of GDP. It is unclear over what time period that increase will occur

NATO guidelines suggest each member state should spend at least 2% of their gross domestic product (GDP) on defence

Russia is hiking state spending on national defence by a quarter in 2025 to 6.3% of gross domestic product (GDP), the highest levels since the Cold War

Defence spending will rise to 13.5 trillion roubles ($145 billion) in 2025, the fourth year of what Russia calls "a special military operation" in Ukraine, up 25% from the 2024 level.
Defence spending will account for 32% of total 2025 budget expenditure of 41.5 trillion roubles.

[Archery1969]

‘Negligent to point of STUPIDITY!’: Ex-soldier warns ‘Russia sees itself as at war with Britain’ as he tears into Labour defence spend

The Labour government has committed to raising UK defence spending to 2.5% of GDP. It is unclear over what time period that increase will occur

NATO guidelines suggest each member state should spend at least 2% of their gross domestic product (GDP) on defence

Russia is hiking state spending on national defence by a quarter in 2025 to 6.3% of gross domestic product (GDP), the highest levels since the Cold War

Defence spending will rise to 13.5 trillion roubles ($145 billion) in 2025, the fourth year of what Russia calls "a special military operation" in Ukraine, up 25% from the 2024 level.
Defence spending will account for 32% of total 2025 budget expenditure of 41.5 trillion roubles.

That amount is peanuts as NATO spent $1.3 Trillion on defence during 2024.

Russia potential is up against a collective being NATO. It can’t compete with that type of spending, manpower or equipment in conventional terms. That’s why Putin is always threatening to use Nukes. Without those it wouldn’t be able to last more than 72 hours in a conventional conflict.

Don’t forget Putin and Russia thought they were going to smash Ukraine within 48 hours. Yeah, right.

[greenmark]

‘Negligent to point of STUPIDITY!’: Ex-soldier warns ‘Russia sees itself as at war with Britain’ as he tears into Labour defence spend

The Labour government has committed to raising UK defence spending to 2.5% of GDP. It is unclear over what time period that increase will occur

NATO guidelines suggest each member state should spend at least 2% of their gross domestic product (GDP) on defence

Russia is hiking state spending on national defence by a quarter in 2025 to 6.3% of gross domestic product (GDP), the highest levels since the Cold War

Defence spending will rise to 13.5 trillion roubles ($145 billion) in 2025, the fourth year of what Russia calls "a special military operation" in Ukraine, up 25% from the 2024 level.
Defence spending will account for 32% of total 2025 budget expenditure of 41.5 trillion roubles.

That amount is peanuts as NATO spent $1.3 Trillion on defence during 2024.

Russia potential is up against a collective being NATO. It can’t compete with that type of spending, manpower or equipment in conventional terms. That’s why Putin is always threatening to use Nukes. Without those it wouldn’t be able to last more than 72 hours in a conventional conflict.

Don’t forget Putin and Russia thought they were going to smash Ukraine within 48 hours. Yeah, right.

I thought Ukraine would be overwhelmed easily. It has turned into a WW1 type war of attrition. I do wonder why Putin hasn't used everything he's got to achieve victory. Right now it looks like the peace will involve Ukraine ceding Donbas, Crimea and the land corridor to Kherson.
Has it been worth the cost? For me, of course not. It's been an indescribable waste of lives, destruction of homes and carefully crafted livelihoods and communitiies. Putin is a tyrant for sure. And I know there was a strong pro-russian, anti-Ukraine movement in the Donbas but what has the killing achieved? A wasteland.

[Archery1969]

‘Negligent to point of STUPIDITY!’: Ex-soldier warns ‘Russia sees itself as at war with Britain’ as he tears into Labour defence spend

The Labour government has committed to raising UK defence spending to 2.5% of GDP. It is unclear over what time period that increase will occur

NATO guidelines suggest each member state should spend at least 2% of their gross domestic product (GDP) on defence

Russia is hiking state spending on national defence by a quarter in 2025 to 6.3% of gross domestic product (GDP), the highest levels since the Cold War

Defence spending will rise to 13.5 trillion roubles ($145 billion) in 2025, the fourth year of what Russia calls "a special military operation" in Ukraine, up 25% from the 2024 level.
Defence spending will account for 32% of total 2025 budget expenditure of 41.5 trillion roubles.

That amount is peanuts as NATO spent $1.3 Trillion on defence during 2024.

Russia potential is up against a collective being NATO. It can’t compete with that type of spending, manpower or equipment in conventional terms. That’s why Putin is always threatening to use Nukes. Without those it wouldn’t be able to last more than 72 hours in a conventional conflict.

Don’t forget Putin and Russia thought they were going to smash Ukraine within 48 hours. Yeah, right.

I thought Ukraine would be overwhelmed easily. It has turned into a WW1 type war of attrition. I do wonder why Putin hasn't used everything he's got to achieve victory. Right now it looks like the peace will involve Ukraine ceding Donbas, Crimea and the land corridor to Kherson.
Has it been worth the cost? For me, of course not. It's been an indescribable waste of lives, destruction of homes and carefully crafted livelihoods and communitiies. Putin is a tyrant for sure. And I know there was a strong pro-russian, anti-Ukraine movement in the Donbas but what has the killing achieved? A wasteland.

I suspect Putin will accept Trumps deal. Regroup and go again once Trump leaves office in 4 years time feeling emboldened. Rinse and repeat.

I said it at the start of the War, Putin needed to be taken out. My view won’t change. Everyone is too scared to take him on because of the Nuke element.

So it’s a case of the world will just have to put up with him come what may.

It’s total weakness not to engage, but I understand why.

[greenmark]

That amount is peanuts as NATO spent $1.3 Trillion on defence during 2024.

Russia potential is up against a collective being NATO. It can’t compete with that type of spending, manpower or equipment in conventional terms. That’s why Putin is always threatening to use Nukes. Without those it wouldn’t be able to last more than 72 hours in a conventional conflict.

Don’t forget Putin and Russia thought they were going to smash Ukraine within 48 hours. Yeah, right.

I thought Ukraine would be overwhelmed easily. It has turned into a WW1 type war of attrition. I do wonder why Putin hasn't used everything he's got to achieve victory. Right now it looks like the peace will involve Ukraine ceding Donbas, Crimea and the land corridor to Kherson.
Has it been worth the cost? For me, of course not. It's been an indescribable waste of lives, destruction of homes and carefully crafted livelihoods and communitiies. Putin is a tyrant for sure. And I know there was a strong pro-russian, anti-Ukraine movement in the Donbas but what has the killing achieved? A wasteland.

I suspect Putin will accept Trumps deal. Regroup and go again once Trump leaves office in 4 years time feeling emboldened. Rinse and repeat.

I said it at the start of the War, Putin needed to be taken out. My view won’t change. Everyone is too scared to take him on because of the Nuke element.

So it’s a case of the world will just have to put up with him come what may.

It’s total weakness not to engage, but I understand why.

I'm beginning to to be swayed by your assassination approach.
But I'm not clever enough to understand what that would produce. Although I (with huge guilt about the loss of a life) would be satisfied if I heard Putin had been assassinated. What we sow we reap eh?
With a bit of luck he'll be dead by then. Then who do we deal with? A younger Putineque nutter.

[Archery1969]

I thought Ukraine would be overwhelmed easily. It has turned into a WW1 type war of attrition. I do wonder why Putin hasn't used everything he's got to achieve victory. Right now it looks like the peace will involve Ukraine ceding Donbas, Crimea and the land corridor to Kherson.
Has it been worth the cost? For me, of course not. It's been an indescribable waste of lives, destruction of homes and carefully crafted livelihoods and communitiies. Putin is a tyrant for sure. And I know there was a strong pro-russian, anti-Ukraine movement in the Donbas but what has the killing achieved? A wasteland.

I suspect Putin will accept Trumps deal. Regroup and go again once Trump leaves office in 4 years time feeling emboldened. Rinse and repeat.

I said it at the start of the War, Putin needed to be taken out. My view won’t change. Everyone is too scared to take him on because of the Nuke element.

So it’s a case of the world will just have to put up with him come what may.

It’s total weakness not to engage, but I understand why.

I'm beginning to to be swayed by your assassination approach.
But I'm not clever enough to understand what that would produce. Although I (with huge guilt about the loss of a life) would be satisfied if I heard Putin had been assassinated. What we sow we reap eh?
With a bit of luck he'll be dead by then. Then who do we deal with? A younger Putineque nutter.

Unfortunately, because of the Nuke option and like you said, who would replace Putin. You would have todo the most secret, coordinated, military exercise not seen since the Second World War.

- Take Putin out (1)
- Destroy upper and lower Russian parliament (650)
- Military targets at home and overseas (76)
- Infrastructure targets (24)

It’s very doable by NATO and the USA with a coordinated attack combined with Ukraine launching all its drones and supplied missiles to confuse Russian defences.

The only elephant in the room would be Russian nuclear submarines at sea. Although I suspect the USA knows where they are roughly.

Take out all the above, with secrecy in a combined effort and bobs your uncle.

Obviously, hundreds of thousands would be killed and allot of civilians. Overwhelmingly, Russian.

I suspect, if somehow, NATO and USA neutralised the Nuke element quickly, then Russia would surrender asap etc.

[greenmark]

I suspect Putin will accept Trumps deal. Regroup and go again once Trump leaves office in 4 years time feeling emboldened. Rinse and repeat.

I said it at the start of the War, Putin needed to be taken out. My view won’t change. Everyone is too scared to take him on because of the Nuke element.

So it’s a case of the world will just have to put up with him come what may.

It’s total weakness not to engage, but I understand why.

I'm beginning to to be swayed by your assassination approach.
But I'm not clever enough to understand what that would produce. Although I (with huge guilt about the loss of a life) would be satisfied if I heard Putin had been assassinated. What we sow we reap eh?
With a bit of luck he'll be dead by then. Then who do we deal with? A younger Putineque nutter.

Unfortunately, because of the Nuke option and like you said, who would replace Putin. You would have todo the most secret, coordinated, military exercise not seen since the Second World War.

- Take Putin out (1)
- Destroy upper and lower Russian parliament (650)
- Military targets at home and overseas (76)
- Infrastructure targets (24)

It’s very doable by NATO and the USA with a coordinated attack combined with Ukraine launching all its drones and supplied missiles to confuse Russian defences.

The only elephant in the room would be Russian nuclear submarines at sea. Although I suspect the USA knows where they are roughly.

Take out all the above, with secrecy in a combined effort and bobs your uncle.

Obviously, hundreds of thousands would be killed and allot of civilians. Overwhelmingly, Russian.

I suspect, if somehow, NATO and USA neutralised the Nuke element quickly, then Russia would surrender asap etc.

Let's hope Russian intelligence isn't viewing this thread.

[Archery1969]

I'm beginning to to be swayed by your assassination approach.
But I'm not clever enough to understand what that would produce. Although I (with huge guilt about the loss of a life) would be satisfied if I heard Putin had been assassinated. What we sow we reap eh?
With a bit of luck he'll be dead by then. Then who do we deal with? A younger Putineque nutter.

Unfortunately, because of the Nuke option and like you said, who would replace Putin. You would have todo the most secret, coordinated, military exercise not seen since the Second World War.

- Take Putin out (1)
- Destroy upper and lower Russian parliament (650)
- Military targets at home and overseas (76)
- Infrastructure targets (24)

It’s very doable by NATO and the USA with a coordinated attack combined with Ukraine launching all its drones and supplied missiles to confuse Russian defences.

The only elephant in the room would be Russian nuclear submarines at sea. Although I suspect the USA knows where they are roughly.

Take out all the above, with secrecy in a combined effort and bobs your uncle.

Obviously, hundreds of thousands would be killed and allot of civilians. Overwhelmingly, Russian.

I suspect, if somehow, NATO and USA neutralised the Nuke element quickly, then Russia would surrender asap etc.

Let's hope Russian intelligence isn't viewing this thread.

I know most people think I am nuts.

But, don’t forget, Putin and Russia basically shit themselves when 3,700 Wagner forces were on there way to Moscow. Hardly any resistance and they killed over 300 Russian soldiers, pilots and police officers. At one point so called Russian loyal troops switch sides to help them.

Therefore, are people really telling me that USA Navy Seals, USA Delta Force, UK SAS/SBS and German GSG9 special forces couldn’t take Putin, Kremlin and FSB out combined with Ukraine launching everything plus NATO.

I think not. Russia would be on its knees with Putin sitting on a toilet pleading for toilet paper and Imodium.

[greenmark]

Unfortunately, because of the Nuke option and like you said, who would replace Putin. You would have todo the most secret, coordinated, military exercise not seen since the Second World War.

- Take Putin out (1)
- Destroy upper and lower Russian parliament (650)
- Military targets at home and overseas (76)
- Infrastructure targets (24)

It’s very doable by NATO and the USA with a coordinated attack combined with Ukraine launching all its drones and supplied missiles to confuse Russian defences.

The only elephant in the room would be Russian nuclear submarines at sea. Although I suspect the USA knows where they are roughly.

Take out all the above, with secrecy in a combined effort and bobs your uncle.

Obviously, hundreds of thousands would be killed and allot of civilians. Overwhelmingly, Russian.

I suspect, if somehow, NATO and USA neutralised the Nuke element quickly, then Russia would surrender asap etc.

Let's hope Russian intelligence isn't viewing this thread.

I know most people think I am nuts.

But, don’t forget, Putin and Russia basically shit themselves when 3,700 Wagner forces were on there way to Moscow. Hardly any resistance and they killed over 300 Russian soldiers, pilots and police officers. At one point so called Russian loyal troops switch sides to help them.

Therefore, are people really telling me that USA Navy Seals, USA Delta Force, UK SAS/SBS and German GSG9 special forces couldn’t take Putin, Kremlin and FSB out combined with Ukraine launching everything plus NATO.

I think not. Russia would be on its knees with Putin sitting on a toilet pleading for toilet paper and Imodium.

I don't think you're nuts.
You changed my opinion of why US residents are so attached to the 2nd amendment. The US is huge, communities still blossom and dilapidate regularly. The US is still the wild west. A gun is handy, perhaps essential.
But the notion of a war with Russia is daft. I see negotiating with Putin is like chatting to the devil, but a chat is better than squandering lives.

[ForFolksSake]

RAF put on alert with fears Vladimir Putin will sabotage North Sea pipeline....

UK security officials are worried that the next target could be pipelines that transport over 40% of Britain's entire gas supply. The impact of an attack like that could be devastating, with potential winter blackouts in Britain...

[firlandsfarm]

RAF put on alert with fears Vladimir Putin will sabotage North Sea pipeline....

UK security officials are worried that the next target could be pipelines that transport over 40% of Britain's entire gas supply. The impact of an attack like that could be devastating, with potential winter blackouts in Britain...

Time to buy shares in 'off-grid' companies!