Excuses, Excuses, Excuses

[sionascaig]

Find it quite scary as a lot of his old party candidates were clearly half-witted foaming-at-the-mouth bigoted racists. Hopefully he will have a better screening process this time.

(and I do mean "racists" as opposed to having a genuine concern about immigration)

That said, Farage as PM or having a leading role in a UK Gov will get Indie way up the agenda again ...

Oh dear I see that old (never proven) bandwagon is back! I think "foaming-at-the-mouth" just about sums up the substantiality of such generalisations! For example "a lot" needs defining, it could mean differing numbers for different people.

People go on about Farage being a racist but I've yet to see a clear racist comment from him, not wanting illegal immigrants is not racist. It is your right to feel offended if you choose so but as Ricky Gervais said being offended doesn't make it wrong.

As for the prospects of Indie coming back in the mix ... great, another good thing Farage will have brought about!

I'd consider one "foaming-at-the-mouth" racist "a lot". Appreciate you may have a different view and be quite happy with loads more...

But I think you misunderstood me - I'm not saying Farage is a racist.

You just have to look at who he / his parties have had to expel in the past. He openly admits they have a problem in that regard.

Take his word for it not mine.

[sionascaig]

Do you really want to stop the boats? If so then you should back digital ID cards.

Do not see the connection.

Smuggler to Migrant: Do you have a digital ID card
Migrant: No
Smuggler: Can't get on the dingy then....

Moronic...

Think beyond the boats, think of how more difficult it could make living for those (including illegal migrants) who didn't have one.

A solution beloved by Facist regimes.

The Nazis introduced something similar for Jews.

[ForFolksSake]

Do not see the connection.

Smuggler to Migrant: Do you have a digital ID card
Migrant: No
Smuggler: Can't get on the dingy then....

Moronic...

Building site employer to Migrant: Do you have a digital ID card
Migrant: No
Building site employer: Can't have a job here then...
.
Brilliant – do you see the connection ?

Maybe there is a case to be made for having ID cards ..

Absolutely

1. Keep track of people entering and leaving the country

[sionascaig]

Absolutely

1. Keep track of people entering and leaving the country

Already do that...

I think what you are saying is the conservatives completely failed to limit immigration numbers.

In actual fact, they allowed the vast majority of immigrants to be here legally.

It had heehaw to do whether the rest of us had ID Cards or would have made the slightest difference if we did.

Remind me what the Conservative excuses excuses excuses were again?

[firlandsfarm]

Do not see the connection.

Smuggler to Migrant: Do you have a digital ID card
Migrant: No
Smuggler: Can't get on the dingy then....

Moronic...

Think beyond the boats, think of how more difficult it could make living for those (including illegal migrants) who didn't have one.

A solution beloved by Facist regimes.

The Nazis introduced something similar for Jews.

Are you suggesting that all countries with digital ID cards are Fascists? If not then do you think the issue of such a card would turn us into a fascist country?

The problem with illegal immigration into the UK is there is no deterrent. The thought process is "I may as well get on that boat because once there I can stay there as they will only remove me if they can prove I can't claim asylum and even if they do they have nowhere to return me to". It's a no lose no-brainer! We need deterrents, anything that will make them stop and think about the risk/reward ratio which is currently totally in their favour.

[greenmark]

Do not see the connection.

Smuggler to Migrant: Do you have a digital ID card
Migrant: No
Smuggler: Can't get on the dingy then....

Moronic...

Think beyond the boats, think of how more difficult it could make living for those (including illegal migrants) who didn't have one.

A solution beloved by Facist regimes.

The Nazis introduced something similar for Jews.

Id cards are a smokescreen. In France a minority live without id or any legal documentation to reside or work. They rely on a network of kind or dodgy people that provide jobs, housing. Quite how they access healthcare, I don't know. But if you're ill will any doctor say "Sorry mate, no ID no treatment"?
Boats across the channel are only significant in the jeopardy involved. How many vehicles go thru the Chunnel? How many are scrupulouly checked?
This whle subject really winds me up. Why are we so obsessed with pulling up the drawbridge and pretending we can operate in splendid isoaltion.
Isn't it more logical to invest in every citizen including illegals to benefit the country? We're like King Canute (and that's the actual figure not a translation of an expletive).

[firlandsfarm]

Absolutely

1. Keep track of people entering and leaving the country

Already do that...

I think what you are saying is the conservatives completely failed to limit immigration numbers.

In actual fact, they allowed the vast majority of immigrants to be here legally.

It had heehaw to do whether the rest of us had ID Cards or would have made the slightest difference if we did.

Remind me what the Conservative excuses excuses excuses were again?

I would be the first to agree immigration management under the Conservatives was appallingly weak but I would also say they were not helped by the LL's and the courts.

[firlandsfarm]

Why are we so obsessed with pulling up the drawbridge and pretending we can operate in splendid isoaltion.

Here is another of those (un)true bandwagons I referred to in an earlier post. We are against uncontrolled/illegal immigration. No drawbridge, no isolation. Farage for one has always advocated this. Controlled immigration would improve the country and should be encouraged (the control).

[ForFolksSake]

Think beyond the boats, think of how more difficult it could make living for those (including illegal migrants) who didn't have one.

A solution beloved by Facist regimes.

The Nazis introduced something similar for Jews.

Isn't it more logical to invest in every citizen including illegals to benefit the country?

Absolutely not ...

illegal immigration “fosters a twilight world of criminality, dependence and exploitation in which modern slavery flourishes”.

That's why Labour have committed to "Smash the gangs" ... how are you progressing with that Sir Kier by the way ( that's a zero out of ten from me then )

sionascaig wrote: ↑

Maybe there is a case to be made for having ID cards ..

Absolutely

2. End trafficking....

[greenmark]

Ah Eureka!!! Let's build a wall! Oh but how would we get food from the world. How would we sustain our health and care systems.
Really hate this Island mentality. It's feeble. We left Europe mostly due to this mentality and the drive of powerful people not to be constrained by the EU's regulation (which we used have a say about). To date, being out of the EU has not benefited us at all.

[ForFolksSake]

To date, being out of the EU has not benefited us at all.

To date bombing Iraq has not benefited us at all

[greenmark]

To date, being out of the EU has not benefited us at all.

To date bombing Iraq has not benefited us at all

That's not correct is it?
We stopped Saddam who was a brutal dictator on the verge of invading neighbouring countries. Sure enough Iraq and the Middle East in general is a mess.
The justifications for joining the US to tackle Saddam are pretty flimsy - no WMD's found, a highly respected weapons inspector killed himself over revelations.
Blair has since said he would have joined the coalitiion to depose Saddam regardless of the presence or not of WMD's. Which if you remember was THE public justification for UK intervention in Iraq.
We are lions lead by donkeys we just have to hope our donkey has a moral compass and competence.

[firlandsfarm]

Ah Eureka!!! Let's build a wall! Oh but how would we get food from the world. How would we sustain our health and care systems.
Really hate this Island mentality. It's feeble. We left Europe mostly due to this mentality and the drive of powerful people not to be constrained by the EU's regulation (which we used have a say about). To date, being out of the EU has not benefited us at all.

See what I mean ... no suggestion of a 'wall', not even a metaphorical one but the immigrant lovers keep saying the others want no immigrants. That is not the case, such unsubstantiated misleading claims strengthen the fable.

[ForFolksSake]

To date, being out of the EU has not benefited us at all.

To date bombing Iraq has not benefited us at all

We are lions lead by donkeys we just have to hope our donkey has a moral compass and competence.

Yes and our donkeys, driven by the "will of the people", will lead us into having ID cards in this country and bring us into the digital age like the rest of the World are. To make Great Britain again

[firlandsfarm]

We stopped Saddam who was a brutal dictator on the verge of invading neighbouring countries.

Interesting. Does that mean we should be bombing Russia? They are led by a brutal dictator who is invading neighbouring countries! Also what was the cost in lives of the Iraq campaign, not just military but also civilian deaths in the civil war that followed!