I don't get it

[wearthefoxhat]

I’ve always found it interesting how many people who bet don’t really get the wider opportunity that’s in front of them with Betting exchanges.

It’s not just trading either. Even at a basic level, things like price, value, and timing seem to be overlooked. Some people still don’t understand that getting the right price matters more than picking winners, or that markets move and you can take advantage of that. And it still amazes me how many people don’t really understand a lay bet, or don’t even realise that laying exists as an option.

A lot of people still seem to be stuck in a very traditional bookmaker mindset. Pick something, back it, hope it wins, move on to the next one. That approach ignores so much.

I’ve had a Betfair account for 25 years now and have been full time for most of that. Exchanges are easily the best betting platform ever created.

Why don't people get it?

Well what is it that we arent getting? I've watched so many of your videos on YouTube, I'm quite frankly sick of hearing your voice, and yet none of those several hundred hours of video have materialised into anything remotely profitable... I just can't find a single approch that works.....

I found Peter Webb's you-tube videos informative. A lot will depend on your own learning style: Maybe Visual doesn't suit you. (I think his voice is ok, you can always put it on sub titles)

VARK

Visual: Learns best through pictures, graphs, charts, and demonstrations.
Auditory/Aural: Prefers listening, discussions, and spoken instructions.
Reading/Writing: Excels with text, notes, lists, and written information.
Kinesthetic: Learns by doing, through physical activity, practice, and hands-on experience.

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It helps to understand the Bet Angel software a little, the forum posts on here and bots posted by Dallas will do that.

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Without stating the obvious, A.I. will also speed up your learning too, if you put work into the prompts and follow through.

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One thing's for sure, no one is gonna hand it to you on a plate, those days are gone.

[Goobs]

I'm very much a visual, money-see-monkey-do learner, hence why I consume several TB of YouTube data a month....

One thing's for sure, no one is gonna hand it to you on a plate, those days are gone.

Yes, and I can see why, an edge is so hard to come by why would you share it? Back in the day, the runners would befriend the floor traders, over time and with trust built, they would show you the ropes, teach you their edge, but back then, the competition wasn't as tight, since the algo boys came along and reduced every market inefficiency to zero...

[Goobs]

This thread derailed quickly.

I have a couple of friends who live in New Jersey who got Betfair accounts when they were open in the US briefly. They were completely turned off by the whole thing coming from regular bookies and closed thier accounts within a month. Yet these same guys are all about Polymarket and Kalshi. Can't get enough of it now. Which, honestly, when you click on a market and look at the options looks a lot more complecated to me than the BF order book.

Goobs. You seem like an ok fella. But your posts in this thread smells a bit entitled. Finanical markets vs Betfair. You ever watch Wigan play Bath in the cross code series back in the early 2000s? Each got stuffed in their alternate codes. Same sport but 2 different games.

Also. Personally it took me 2.5 years to stop losing money. Then another 18 months of breaking even before becoming consistently profitable. Getting your panties in a twist about some arbitary timeline with no wins to show seems petulant. If you've watched 100 of hours of Bet Angel vids online why are you suprised that you are getting your pants pulled down when trying to exit red trades in the last 25% of a race. Or confused as to why stops dont really work in-play.

People have been very nice to you though. Stick with it. I wish you the best.

There is some deep irony in this post....

[Lynskey888]

I think all the smart/big stakes money is already on Betair, it's only the leisure punters and value-ignorant who aren't and I don't think they'd bring much to the table.

I often see markets which have volume but very little backing activity, even in the period directly before the event starts. It feels like a stalemate between traders and the markets move in fits and starts, often sparked by the actions of very big players.

I think a steady stream of punters’ cash would create its own opportunities if leisure gamblers were really using the exchange en masse.

[ShaunWhite]

I think all the smart/big stakes money is already on Betair, it's only the leisure punters and value-ignorant who aren't and I don't think they'd bring much to the table.

I often see markets which have volume but very little backing activity, even in the period directly before the event starts. It feels like a stalemate between traders and the markets move in fits and starts, often sparked by the actions of very big players.

I think a steady stream of punters’ cash would create its own opportunities if leisure gamblers were really using the exchange en masse.

I can't really disagree with you, the more the merrier. They won't bring much liquidity but a bit more Tv is always welcome.

[Euler]

Betfair almost did the right thing when they start the sportbooks, they sort of layered it over the exchange. But then Breon came along and just ran it as a sportsbook.

I always felt PP/Betfair could have used the Flutter brand for a completely different sportsbook and just front ended the exchange into a simpler format.

[Euler]

The trouble is, it's all too easy to get margin from the uneducated punter with 'offers'.

[Lynskey888]

..the more the merrier.

Yeah, all welcome and every little bit adds to the total volume.

Betfair almost did the right thing when they start the sportbooks, they sort of layered it over the exchange. But then Breon came along and just ran it as a sportsbook.

I always felt PP/Betfair could have used the Flutter brand for a completely different sportsbook and just front ended the exchange into a simpler format.

Your videos have probably brought more people to the exchange than any official promotional activity.

[Dublin_Flyer]

I think a lot of everyday punters don't really give a shit about value, they count winners that day/week not long term profit. The "Up 300 today"s are talked about a lot more than the "Down 150 today"s.

Plus there's the social aspect of hanging around a bookies with 20+ like minded people interested in sports betting, having a chat and a laugh, free tea or coffee in some , and sharing "tips"

Then there's the fact on-street bookies are still using fractional odds, and to most punters you'd think you were teaching them algebra through Japanese trying to explain decimal odds. Some people just don't want to learn new stuff.

I personally think sticking with fractional odds in on-street bookies is a way of keeping punters in the dark ages so they can't see the difference between the price they're taking, and the alternative on the exchange if they don't understand decimal odds. Ask any randomer in a bookies if 11/10 is a better price than 6/5 and you'll get a much longer pause, and possibly a google than if you asked is 2.1 higher than 2.2.

[Yasmingrace]

It is interesting to read what you say and I tend to agree with you in some way. As I'm older I remember the days of 10% betting duty and do use traditional bookmakers but I also use the Exchange of a few of the betting Exchanges available. I also think laying bets is a good option. However, my gripes about Betfair are their customer service which is just a mouthpiece reading from a script. Also their outages and technical problems always disrupt the Exchange and never the Casino. If their is an outage the customer always misses out because they say it was beyond their control. I have to say I have never known a bookies to have as many technical problems as Betfair. One other point is because Betfair has the monopoly because of their greater liquidity they do take punters for granted.

[ShaunWhite]

I think a lot of everyday punters don't really give a shit about value, they count winners that day/week not long term profit.

Exactly. And so the only benefit the exchange brings is irrelevant to them and all they get is the agro.

But betting in shops isn't just about prices. It's a social club for a lot of old blokes, a break from loneliness or a chance to save their own heating bill. And when one isn't there they go see how he is. Just just pubs used to be. When you're betting 25p each way then the companionship is worth more than a few % on the price.

My town's got a population of 7k and has (always) had just one bookie, an indy that opened in 1962. And oldies can have a free cuppa and needn't even bet. He drives a Roller because his prices are shit but it's part of the community.

[lotora]

I asked a mate from England who’s also living here in Thailand why he even bothers using anything other than Betfair, and he genuinely couldn’t explain it.

No reason, no argument, just habit, so for him it’s not even the “going to the shop for the atmosphere” thing either.

[ruthlessimon]

I purchased the course from Trader Carl as he seemed to know how to make serious money doing this.........course was an utter waste of time, just videos of him trading and not really explainng why or what he was doing.

My rule of thumb for courses: If the reviews aren’t “please take this down”, I’m not interested. unless I can get it free off someone

Trading is fundamentally rivalrous: real edges die with mass adoption, so anything truly potent gets guarded.

You paid for the eternal human hunger for easy answers & course sellers will happily fill that bottomless niche.

[Trader Al]

Trust me i'm trying to, I'm trying to get filled at favourable prices (4.0 to 2.0), to keep my liability in check but I keep getting trapped in bad trades, the market then moves so fast in the closing stages of the race that greeing up or trying to trade out of your position just seems like random buttom mashing!

I'm pretty close to giving up really, I feel like I've wasted two years just playing some kind of random game....

Have you tried trading Football, I was like you with Horse racing but switched to Footy a few years back. Took a couple of years to workout some strategies, and you have to keep checking/adjusting them but doing ok now.
I also use automation a lot, takes the human element out of it which was my real problem with the horses. Automation is also easier to set up on footy I feel.

[Goobs]

Yes, I started on football with FTS, backing FH1.5 goals markets, it was a simple data driven strat but I ended up losing £1500 doing that due to so few goals being scored that season, so I gave up after that.

I don't really like football and the culture around it, I also found the trading hours very unsociable.