Krystof -
I think Betfair would argue that this is different to a 'fat fingers' situation, inasmuch as the money being offered to the market wasn't real, due to someone trying to bet with money they didn't have. However, there's a good case IMHO for saying that Betfair should be liable for bets placed with phantom money.
Let's use an analogy. Someone notices that their bank's computer has screwed up, and allowed them to vastly exceed their £1,000 overdraft limit. So they think 'While I can get away with this, I'll buy some shares and make a quick profit'. So they buy £1,000,000 of shares.
The shares subsequenty fall in value by 20%, and then the bank discovers what has happened.
The fact that the bank is going to have to take a £200K loss is a matter between them and their customer. The guy who sold the shares shouldn't be expected to buy them back for a million pounds, yet by voiding the bets, surely that's basically what Betfair have made their customers do!
Jeff
Leopardstown - 14:00 - Christmas Hurdle - Voler la vedette
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andyfuller
- Posts: 4619
- Joined: Wed Mar 25, 2009 12:23 pm
Channel 4 News about to run a story on this.
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andyfuller
- Posts: 4619
- Joined: Wed Mar 25, 2009 12:23 pm
Jeff you are famous - one of your posts on the forum made it on to the news 
Grrr! 
I don't have a TV, and I was going to ask my dad to record it for me in case that happened, but decided against it!
Hopefully they'll put the clip online!
Jeff
I don't have a TV, and I was going to ask my dad to record it for me in case that happened, but decided against it!
Hopefully they'll put the clip online!
Jeff
andyfuller wrote:Jeff you are famous - one of your posts on the forum made it on to the news
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andyfuller
- Posts: 4619
- Joined: Wed Mar 25, 2009 12:23 pm
Sorry to disappoint Jeff, it was just your username on the side. One of my posts did get some screen time as did a few others, basically they just scrolled down one of the pages of this thread showing it on TV.
Don't be expecting a queue of people waiting for your autograph lol
Don't be expecting a queue of people waiting for your autograph lol
Even if they had given my full name and mugshot, I wouldn't expect anyone to have remembered 5 minutes later! 
The closest I came to recognition from something I wrote was after I wrote that article for the BBC news website, about chatting up women in the street. I was in a pub, and I'm pretty sure some young women were talking about it. I'll never forget the look of surprise of one of them when she passed me as she was leaving! I was kicking myself after that, as I could have approached them and asked them about how they felt about being chatted up without sounding like a creep!
Jeff
The closest I came to recognition from something I wrote was after I wrote that article for the BBC news website, about chatting up women in the street. I was in a pub, and I'm pretty sure some young women were talking about it. I'll never forget the look of surprise of one of them when she passed me as she was leaving! I was kicking myself after that, as I could have approached them and asked them about how they felt about being chatted up without sounding like a creep!
Jeff
andyfuller wrote:Sorry to disappoint Jeff, it was just your username on the side. One of my posts did get some screen time as did a few others, basically they just scrolled down one of the pages of this thread showing it on TV.
Don't be expecting a queue of people waiting for your autograph lol
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andyfuller
- Posts: 4619
- Joined: Wed Mar 25, 2009 12:23 pm
I wouldn't rush to try and catch it tbh, it was pretty pointless. Seems like no one took them up on their offer of being interviewed as the only customer reaction bit was them scrolling down this thread.
My view is that in a week if not less but at most 2 the whole episode will be written down in the history that is Betfair. Things will get back to normal, we will all still use Betfair and their share price will rebound so I duly annouce to my legion of followers a buy note and remind you all to send me my 60% of your winnings from shorting them when I said earlier in the thread
In reality it affected very very few customers, far fewer than the original PC and about half of the people with the 'super' PC.
It seems pretty obvious it was a technical error of some sort or another as no one in the history of Betfair has had that much funds on hold. No one would be given credit to such a level and I don't believe Betfair would be so stupid as to be operating anything that could expose them to such liabilities. As I said earlier in the thread, they could have in theory been put out of business if they were up to something.
There is little chance of legal action as I don't think anyone expects to be paid out now, look at Barney Curley, he can't get paid out on his bets for much less, different circumstances and bookmakers obviously.
What I think the case has highlighted is the deep negative feeling held towards Betfair and how people/media are more than happy to kick them when they are down. Mark Davies argued on his blog that he has seen the corner turned in how they interact with customers which I do in a way agree with but not hugely.
They were as ever very slow out of the blocks and made promises they couldn't keep and made no attempt to.
It also raises questions which I am surprised hasn't been picked up upon more which I raised earlier, who were the bets actually being matched by. I assume Betfair but it doesn't seem clear and this could be something used to beat them with by other parties if they were on the ball which they don't seem to be and could have implication for all horse racing traders.
But anyway, it will be good to be able to say in years times, I was part of it
My view is that in a week if not less but at most 2 the whole episode will be written down in the history that is Betfair. Things will get back to normal, we will all still use Betfair and their share price will rebound so I duly annouce to my legion of followers a buy note and remind you all to send me my 60% of your winnings from shorting them when I said earlier in the thread
In reality it affected very very few customers, far fewer than the original PC and about half of the people with the 'super' PC.
It seems pretty obvious it was a technical error of some sort or another as no one in the history of Betfair has had that much funds on hold. No one would be given credit to such a level and I don't believe Betfair would be so stupid as to be operating anything that could expose them to such liabilities. As I said earlier in the thread, they could have in theory been put out of business if they were up to something.
There is little chance of legal action as I don't think anyone expects to be paid out now, look at Barney Curley, he can't get paid out on his bets for much less, different circumstances and bookmakers obviously.
What I think the case has highlighted is the deep negative feeling held towards Betfair and how people/media are more than happy to kick them when they are down. Mark Davies argued on his blog that he has seen the corner turned in how they interact with customers which I do in a way agree with but not hugely.
They were as ever very slow out of the blocks and made promises they couldn't keep and made no attempt to.
It also raises questions which I am surprised hasn't been picked up upon more which I raised earlier, who were the bets actually being matched by. I assume Betfair but it doesn't seem clear and this could be something used to beat them with by other parties if they were on the ball which they don't seem to be and could have implication for all horse racing traders.
But anyway, it will be good to be able to say in years times, I was part of it
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superfrank
- Posts: 2762
- Joined: Fri Aug 14, 2009 8:28 pm
another reason to make this a private forum?
Jeff, as it happens I think Betfair did the right thing too [in voiding the in-play market] (no choice in reality), but i would really like to know the precise nature of the "technical fault" because the explanations so far don't make enough sense.
Jeff, as it happens I think Betfair did the right thing too [in voiding the in-play market] (no choice in reality), but i would really like to know the precise nature of the "technical fault" because the explanations so far don't make enough sense.
Absolutely.superfrank wrote:another reason to make this a private forum?
The fact that someone can register. As this guy from C4 did and read and post on the forum is disturbing and brings into focus that there are some with a different "agenda' on here.
I would like PW & BA to have another look at making the forum only available for registered users of the software.
I don't want to restrict my posting, or be careful what I say. Or be worried about giving out info for my Bet Angel "friends". But in light of this I can only see my contributions reduced.
It has never been a truly private forum, nor will it ever be, in that there are no restrictions on who can subscribe to Bet Angel.superfrank wrote:another reason to make this a private forum?
And I prefer the 'open door' policy, as it means the community can benefit from contributions by people who aren't current Bet Angel subscribers.
If the forum was plagued by trolls, as is the case with another trading forum I can think of, then there might be a case for restricting membership. But it isn't - the atmosphere is generally very pleasant - so if it ain't broke...
Jeff
I suspect that there were some bet angel users, and some casual punters who might've seen this and taken some part but I'm sure the lion share would've been taken by boys from sports exchange shops who would be quickest off the block when it comes to in-running. And who would have sufficiently large amount of money in their account as they tend to put through large amount of money on shorter priced but sure fire winners towards the death.It also raises questions which I am surprised hasn't been picked up upon more which I raised earlier, who were the bets actually being matched by. I assume Betfair but it doesn't seem clear and this could be something used to beat them with by other parties if they were on the ball which they don't seem to be and could have implication for all horse racing traders.