Getting matched at BSP

[Iron]

How easy or difficult is it to get matched at BSP (assuming one isn't using astronomical stakes)?

Also, when the amount of money wanting to get backed at BSP and the amount of money wanting to get laid at BSP are unequal, does that mean that some people won't have their bet or lay matched?

Thanks

Jef

[gazuty]

I've done quite a few experiments on this. Lots of $3000 @ 1.01 on the lay side converted to SP - you need a $30 exposure in Australia to be in the SP pool. I've always been matched. Never had a failure to get bsp.

But what I will share is that from time to time I've had an impact on the bsp due to undesirable market share of bsp. Be careful how much of the market you constitute.

Read the link.

http://sp.betfair.com.au/FAQs_detailedWorkings.php

[gutuami]

I tend not to use sp because you always have surprises. Especially with a big bet. Also if it's on a steamer/drifter sp will differ a lot from LTP. I have a screenshot somewhere where LTP was ~2.9 and sp 2.5 or lower. So it's a chance game

[Iron]

Thanks guys

[andyfuller]

How easy or difficult is it to get matched at BSP (assuming one isn't using astronomical stakes)?

It is very easy to get matched at BSP, place your bet and you will be matched. What is sometimes not so easy is getting the odds you might want if you are using large stakes. For small stakes you will have little issue with getting matched at around the LTP. You may sometime get worse but you may also get better. Though you can work out your likely odds if you understand the BFSP. Not sure if Bet Angel has the predicted SP feature that is present in other software but that was useful for seeing what the odds are likely to be.

Also, when the amount of money wanting to get backed at BSP and the amount of money wanting to get laid at BSP are unequal, does that mean that some people won't have their bet or lay matched?

No not unless the amounts are absolutely huge, I never saw one where it was not matched and this included plenty of times when there were 5 figure sums going on. I think I saw a 6 figure amount once though I would have to dig out some old screen shots.

I really suggest people read the link about how the BFSP works, a long with any other new development as the opportunities can be huge but often for a short period. A long time ago I suggested people learn about it, I think you were on of them Jeff. Another great opportunity was XM when that first came in, I know several on the forum cleaned up when it was introduced and they spotted various opportunities it brought up.

The BFSP used to create some of the most fantastic opportunities for trades where you could make 4 figure amounts with ease. As ever though the edge was slowly eradicated and I understand via a fellow trader that such opportunities are rare now but from time to time do still show up.

I tend not to use sp because you always have surprises. Especially with a big bet. Also if it's on a steamer/drifter sp will differ a lot from LTP. I have a screenshot somewhere where LTP was ~2.9 and sp 2.5 or lower. So it's a chance game

It isn't a chance game - it is a matter of understanding the mechanics of how it is reconciled and then it is very predictable.

[mugsgame]

The issue with BFSP is if a horse misses the break (or gets a fast start) it's BFSP is radically altered. No problem getting matched though. I use it for emergencies/safety. Or if i think I can gain an advantage by a horse about to lead. I may drop in an order quite a few ticks below the trading price and take sp, sometimes you get lucky. Sure you have seen me do this on a few vids Jeff.

The biggest ever discrepancy I can remember was not long after it's launch. The Grand national in which Comply or Die won (2008?). Off the top of my head he went off at around 10 and sp was returned at 3ish. They had to reconcile the sp manually or something as there was an uproar. I think they tinkered with it after that.

[weemac]

Another anomaly of the BFSP reconciliation process is that you can have 2 bets waiting to get matched before the off at exactly the same price - one with 'Take SP' selected and the other without. As long as the reconciliation process fully fills the price you were sitting at, the bets will almost certainly end up with 2 different matched prices. As mugs says, you really need a firm understanding of how the process works.

[Iron]

Today, before heading to work, I left a spreadsheet to place backs and lays for me. The idea was that, if my trade was still open at the off, the spreadsheet would submit a back or lay at BSP, and I'd be covered. I tested my spreadsheet on a few races yesterday, and the BSP kicked in fine.

I got home from work expecting to be a couple of quid up or down, but I discovered that I'd lost about £70 in the 14:30 at Lingfield!

I've emailed Betfair to find out what happened, but for now I won't be placing any more bets at BSP. Instead, I'll program my spreadsheet to place no more bets after 10 seconds before the off, and to close all existing trades.

Jeff

[mugsgame]

What could have happened is (this usually happens if you BACK at SP) is it didn't green up, instead left a profit on everything else and a loss on the horse that won. If Laying it would have greened up.

[gazuty]

What could have happened is (this usually happens if you BACK at SP) is it didn't green up, instead left a profit on everything else and a loss on the horse that won. If Laying it would have greened up.

I've never really understood the back side of the bsp algo. The lay side is much easier given it's just dividing liability into the price. Because of the problem above, I only take lays at bsp, not backs.

[Iron]

Hi Mugs

I'm not sure what happened, although I hadn't changed my spreadsheet since yesterday evening, when I tested it and it worked fine.

Oh well, getting my spreadsheet to close before the off, whilst a pain to programme, will at least ensure that I don't get shafted...

Thanks to everyone for your comments.

Jeff

What could have happened is (this usually happens if you BACK at SP) is it didn't green up, instead left a profit on everything else and a loss on the horse that won. If Laying it would have greened up.

[Iron]

I think I misunderstood Mugs's point.

I wasn't aware there was a difference between how Betfair processes back BSP bets and lay BSP bets.

Bizarre.

Jeff

I've never really understood the back side of the bsp algo. The lay side is much easier given it's just dividing liability into the price. Because of the problem above, I only take lays at bsp, not backs.

[Kimmy]

Can you place a bet at BSP within a price range?

I know you can place a LAY BET for liability at the highest price and similar a BACK bet at the lowest price stake
example
If (Horse) BSP >=3.00,<=6 THEN BACK
IF Horse's BSP is 3.00 up to and including 6 then Back
Bet Angel Learner

[mugsgame]

I think I misunderstood Mugs's point.

I wasn't aware there was a difference between how Betfair processes back BSP bets and lay BSP bets.

Bizarre.

Jeff

I've never really understood the back side of the bsp algo. The lay side is much easier given it's just dividing liability into the price. Because of the problem above, I only take lays at bsp, not backs.

Think it's to do with the BF settings.

If you have a BFSP lay of £50 and the odds you were trying to get matched at was 2. The liability would be £50. So BF then use the £50 as liability and divide up your £50 by the odds.

If it was a back bet of £50 at 2, and the odds went against you say down to 1.8. When sp was calculated it would back £50 at whatever SP was (say 1.8) so 50 x 1.8 = £40 which leaves you a red of £50 if this horse goes onto win. Hence the lay gives an equal spread and the back leaves you f*****

well thats the way I understand it Jeff - Does that ring true with what happened to you?

[Iron]

Hi Mugs

Quite possibly - thanks. The horse concerned was the fav that went off at something like 1.37 but lost.

I'll see what the crack team at Betfair have to say when they get around to replying to my email...

Jeff