Royal Ascot 2014

The sport of kings.
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Euler
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Ultimately you have have to see through the money though.

I'll check my video later but there was one race where the money just piled up and you could see that somebody was trying to manipulate the price and failing so I just too a chunk at the current price and up it flew.

Where I went wrong was it came right back much quicker than I expected so I didn't make a penny from it! :(
steven1976
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It would be good to see a pre arranged event of a few big traders on the same event for a big race to see just how different people trade. I doubt their would be many takers however?
tweebie1999
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Joined: Tue Dec 21, 2010 9:23 am

17.00 at Acot behaving like a low grade race at Lingfield !
andyfuller
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tweebie1999 wrote:17.00 at Acot behaving like a low grade race at Lingfield !
Ridiculous markets today.

On Betdaq the fav there was several points higher the whole time but still you couldn't lay it for toffee.

Betdaq has become more choked up with money as the week has gone on. At times I am seeing more lined up on Betdaq than on Betfair. From what I can figure out it is largely being put in and out of the market by bots.

Disappointing day today.
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Euler
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tweebie1999 wrote:17.00 at Acot behaving like a low grade race at Lingfield !
Yeah, that was mental. Didn't get on with that at all. Was holding well but got caught on one of those moves for a loss.
chuck536
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Euler wrote:Ultimately you have have to see through the money though.

I'll check my video later but there was one race where the money just piled up and you could see that somebody was trying to manipulate the price and failing so I just too a chunk at the current price and up it flew.

Where I went wrong was it came right back much quicker than I expected so I didn't make a penny from it! :(
Sure you always have to see though it, trouble being its harder to see through when its dominant over the whole book and appears reactive to any kind of large stake at times. I just had a look at my recording of it and I can't see any large lay at the bottom - just the 20k back money disappearing and several 5k lays chasing it up. Was quite a move, shame you held on for so long, still its good to review it. If we can work it out then it should be easier to profit from it!
steven1976
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Andy, qre you back in the game, never really been away, or just enjoying the big events?
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Euler
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Problem child from the 17:00
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chuck536
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andyfuller wrote: Betdaq has become more choked up with money as the week has gone on. At times I am seeing more lined up on Betdaq than on Betfair. From what I can figure out it is largely being put in and out of the market by bots.

Disappointing day today.

Interesting, all this guff is most definitely automated. Possibly with human intervention IMO - but just speculation obviously.
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Euler
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That's surely an edge for a manual trader though? That's how I see through the big money, it's often easy to see it's misplaced so I'll trade against it.
chuck536
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Euler wrote:That's surely an edge for a manual trader though? That's how I see through the big money, it's often easy to see it's misplaced so I'll trade against it.
Unless of course there is human intervention, and the manipulator is able to hold or push the price (more so in weak markets) manipulating across the book on alternate runners with stakes of 2k,3k,5k,10k or even 50k stacked all over the place like we see earlier?

What is a 1k stake going to do in relation to 50k pushing in the opposite direction? - were not all trading with 6 figure+ banks all the time.
And i guess the manipulator isn't going to worry about someone like Patrick Vietch throwing in a colossal gamble with the Premium Charges that exist at 60%?!

Out of interest - you trade against it and then more and more money appears, what do you do?
steven1976
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Its an edge if you can lay up 160k at 4s without twitching if it pushes down to 3.8s! :lol:

chuck you have to believe in this wash trading. If your matching through your own money the sheep will follow. I know you make good money from it but its going on mate. If you can't beat them......

Direct question to Peter if he wishes to answer it. Do you believe wash trading is prolific on the exchanges (not just horses)?
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Euler
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steven1976 wrote:Direct question to Peter if he wishes to answer it. Do you believe wash trading is prolific on the exchanges (not just horses)?
Betfair have ensured it happens because people are encouraged to generate commission rather than pay the PC.
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Euler
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While we are all moaning, I'd like to say It's nice to have a decent debate.
chuck536
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I believe in it to a degree Stephen although im sure its not as easy as you possibly suggest. Its an advantage though for whoever is doing this as even if its just the thousands of unmatched money its distorting others view on support and resistance and alowing them to see money that isnt their own. But just my view.
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