Royal Ascot 2014
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maycontainnuts
- Posts: 90
- Joined: Wed Oct 10, 2012 5:58 pm
Trading any market has always been tough but the moment you believe the market is against is the moment you have lost it. Everybody has an edge, that changes over time. But don't blame some mysterious force that it's gone, that's the way markets work.
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steven1976
- Posts: 1744
- Joined: Tue Jan 19, 2010 6:28 am
Adapt and survive or curl up and cry and die 
I only do this for a bit of fun, all be it an expensive bit of fun. I'll not say how much but its quite a bit but nothing that I'm going to lose sleep over.
However, its not as much fun these days when you get the front of the book with tiny stakes and beat say 512 to the front and immediately its all matched out to a zero balance (Ausy racing). You know the odds are stacked against you unless you want to take on value and hold a position you are confident in. From what I understand its mainly scalpers that are feeling the manipulation?
As PW said earlier in the thread, I think manipulation will harm the long term horse markets for short term gains because I don't see word of mouth marketing expand the exchanges as it probably did in the early years. Would I advise to 4 mates, go and try this horse racing trading who inturn tell 4,mates.... Absolutely not. Therefore its up to bf to spend more to attract new people to the exchanges and it becomes a vicious circle.
I only do this for a bit of fun, all be it an expensive bit of fun. I'll not say how much but its quite a bit but nothing that I'm going to lose sleep over.
However, its not as much fun these days when you get the front of the book with tiny stakes and beat say 512 to the front and immediately its all matched out to a zero balance (Ausy racing). You know the odds are stacked against you unless you want to take on value and hold a position you are confident in. From what I understand its mainly scalpers that are feeling the manipulation?
As PW said earlier in the thread, I think manipulation will harm the long term horse markets for short term gains because I don't see word of mouth marketing expand the exchanges as it probably did in the early years. Would I advise to 4 mates, go and try this horse racing trading who inturn tell 4,mates.... Absolutely not. Therefore its up to bf to spend more to attract new people to the exchanges and it becomes a vicious circle.
I agree; Its not mysterious. I could give you 9 names of Premium Charge Payers who no longer bother as its not worth the effortjimrobo wrote:its pretty obvious to the full time guys who have been operating in these markets for a decent amount of time that its not a mysterious force....
Edit : 11 if you include JimRobo and Andy Fuller!
Not been about as long as you Jim although i tend to agree... just seen this in the last on the favourite. Newmarket race on the Fav while the focus is on Ascot may i add....jimrobo wrote:its pretty obvious to the full time guys who have been operating in these markets for a decent amount of time that its not a mysterious force. Its an individual with very deep pockets manipulating the market.
A couple of huge matches late on - market barely reacted, was walls of huge amounts of cash either side of the price. Guess someones generating a lot of comms...
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steven1976
- Posts: 1744
- Joined: Tue Jan 19, 2010 6:28 am
Peterle quote
"When you take a VALUE position in play (lets say a back), dont use the normal offset, ask for much much more (in fact it works well by not offsetting at all in certain markets). Sure you don't get as many matched, but when you do...kerching"
Are you saying a bot could easily assess their own risk to see if they could see their potential get out position with other scalpers position. If inplay it cant see its immediate get out position near by (scalper), it may asses its risk and take the best price on offer ( other than its own money)?
By TAKING a value position the bot has the uncertainty of knowing whether its a trader or real bet? If its a trader offering money then it knows that trader doesn't want to take on value, but if money was taken it gives it something to think about?
"When you take a VALUE position in play (lets say a back), dont use the normal offset, ask for much much more (in fact it works well by not offsetting at all in certain markets). Sure you don't get as many matched, but when you do...kerching"
Are you saying a bot could easily assess their own risk to see if they could see their potential get out position with other scalpers position. If inplay it cant see its immediate get out position near by (scalper), it may asses its risk and take the best price on offer ( other than its own money)?
By TAKING a value position the bot has the uncertainty of knowing whether its a trader or real bet? If its a trader offering money then it knows that trader doesn't want to take on value, but if money was taken it gives it something to think about?
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spreadbetting
- Posts: 3140
- Joined: Sun Jan 31, 2010 8:06 pm
Market manipulation has been around ever since Betfair started, I'd be surprised if some of the older traders hadn't tried their hand at luring other punters into taking their bets at some time or other.
Although I must admit I do feel sorry for the unlucky traders, who despite the markets being open for a relatively long time and the option to go either side on plenty of runners, they're the unlucky ones who always seem to enter the market just as this manipulation occurs along with the other unlucky traders who enter a few seconds later only to suffer the same fate.
Although I must admit I do feel sorry for the unlucky traders, who despite the markets being open for a relatively long time and the option to go either side on plenty of runners, they're the unlucky ones who always seem to enter the market just as this manipulation occurs along with the other unlucky traders who enter a few seconds later only to suffer the same fate.
I don't dispute there's some serious manipulation happening here, but the real negativity surrounds our feelings towards BF.
Manipulation has always been around, but we've all come to mistrust BF to the extent we believe they have utterly stripped themselves of any integrity. Therefore, anything dodgy taking place must be them.
Things like XM and Price Rush are the thin ends of the wedge, because it basically means BF are dabbling with the exchange ecosystem. Therefore, are they capable (both logistically and morally) of actually manipulating markets too?
We all know the answer to that!!!
Manipulation has always been around, but we've all come to mistrust BF to the extent we believe they have utterly stripped themselves of any integrity. Therefore, anything dodgy taking place must be them.
Things like XM and Price Rush are the thin ends of the wedge, because it basically means BF are dabbling with the exchange ecosystem. Therefore, are they capable (both logistically and morally) of actually manipulating markets too?
We all know the answer to that!!!
I dont have anything to contribute to your last post Le Tiss but what i do know is that i much prefer your new avatar to the old one. Is that you in the picture ?
No wonder you do well at tennis trading. The more i blow up the picture though , the more it becomes pixelated so i cant make you out.
Which lovely lady of the WTA are you ?
No wonder you do well at tennis trading. The more i blow up the picture though , the more it becomes pixelated so i cant make you out.
Which lovely lady of the WTA are you ?
A wonderful choice.
I watch a lot of womens tennis and not only are they oustanding athletes but they all seem to be of model quality beauty as well ( Carla Suarez Navarro excluded - god she is ugly )
I'm convinced if i got myself castrated my in play performance would improve...........
Apologies for taking the Ascot thread off piste , no doubt Peter will initiate the Wimbledon thread shortly.
I watch a lot of womens tennis and not only are they oustanding athletes but they all seem to be of model quality beauty as well ( Carla Suarez Navarro excluded - god she is ugly )
I'm convinced if i got myself castrated my in play performance would improve...........
Apologies for taking the Ascot thread off piste , no doubt Peter will initiate the Wimbledon thread shortly.
