Greening up in automation

[salmanim140i]

Hi just wondering if any one can shed a bit of light on what I might be doing wrong.

I am running an automation rule for in play horse racing in practise mode.

However as part of that rule I have the rule to green up when in profit so when greater than £0. However when I have watched the in play automation some runners will be in a loss and others in profit. The green up check box is ticked so should show a hedged position across all runners but its actually showing as if I have not ticked the box. Plus the automation kicks in and then greens up but is then in a loss once the market is suspended or the race finished.

I have checked the rule several times and I have it set to green up on any selection when profit is greater than £0... ?

Just cant see what I am doing wrong here.... any suggestions??

Thanks.

[Dallas]

If using a 'Green All Selections' rule it will trigger when the total across all runners is in profit, so that could mean some runners in a loss others profit - as long as the total is >£0.00

'Close trade on Selection with Greening' is what you'd use if you wanted to green up each individual selection when in profit

[salmanim140i]

Thanks for that Dallas...

I'm laying more than 1 runner in a race. My understanding is to green all when in profit so to hedge the field as it were.

But when choosing that option it's like it's just greening up individually and not across the field if that makes sense. That's why I'm confused as to why it's doing it??

Or should I be choosing the other option to green up individually when in profit.

Thanks

[Dallas]

Green All Selections (with a profit condition >£0.00) is greening up all runners to achieve an overall profit which may mean some individual trades/runners are in a loss at the time it triggers but as long as the combined total of them all is still >£0.00 it will trigger.

[salmanim140i]

Yep it does trigger but does not show you like £2.00 profit across all runners. It's actually showing individual results. Which is where I am getting confused.

But your also right in saying that it will trigger, and does show in some cases that it's in profit as above across all runners.

Also as a wee side question. When I am then running the p&l automation is it correct in showing individual profit and loss per horse per race. Or should it show as a hedged profit and loss across all runners??

Thanks dallas I know I am being a pain now.

[Dallas]

Yep it does trigger but does not show you like £2.00 profit across all runners. It's actually showing individual results. Which is where I am getting confused.

Also as a wee side question. When I am then running the p&l automation is it correct in showing individual profit and loss per horse per race. Or should it show as a hedged profit and loss across all runners??

Where is it your looking to see these after the rule has triggered?
If you can provide a screenshot and an example that will maybe be the best way of explaining

[salmanim140i]

I am just watching the race through the one click screen. And at the end of the race it shows as explained.

But I'm at work and will get you a screen shot when at home as yeah probably best to show you.

Any ideas on reading the p&l spreadsheet though once you have ran the automation rule. Cause if I just auto sum the profit and loss the theory looks good. However i know i cant be that fortunate this early into the game haha.

[salmanim140i]

Hi Dallas,

I have managed to get a few screen shots of my results after the race has come to an end and the automation has ran.

as you can see from the screenshot 1 I have managed to make a profit but there are 2 different prices? one @ £3.66 & the other @£11.76. would I assume that its the £3.66 I have won here or is it the £11.76 or both? from the videos I have seen it should just be 1 hedged output right?

I have also copied in a second screen shot that shows a loss against all other racers @ £1.60 apart from Secret Path which shows a positive value of £16.64. when I have checked the log on this race it looks like the automation only managed to match the bet on this horse? but then should it not have hedged up the field if I had won that value?

My strategy is to lay the runners that look like they are going to loose based on the winner coming in if that helps.

I understand by using the green all profit condition as part of the green all rule this should then hedge the field when in profit (greater than £0) and that should be your profit/loss.

The only other thing I can think of is if it went to do this but was unsuccessful??

your help here is much appreciated, been scratching my head trying to understand whats going on. I am still waiting for a screen shot of all the P&L being different for each row and will post as well.

thanks

[Dallas]

You've not greened up in either of those screenshots, your greening rule may have triggered but wasn't matched or wasn't fully matched.

Normally in-play its best to set it to trigger at least 3 time with a 2-3 sec rearm time so if it misses the first time it will trigger again.

Also only a few US races allow in-play betting (can't remember which ones off hand) so it may not have had a chance to even trigger. For those that do go in-play there is next to no in-play liquidity, so you'll have large gaps between prices and find it difficult to get any bets matched even with a rule triggering a few times.

If you try it on UK races this afternoon, with the increased triggers and re-armed times you should see something totally different

[salmanim140i]

Hi Dallas,

Well that does make perfect sense now.

I just thought you could run the automation over the markets and it would work regardless was not sure about specific races (US races) having rules etc.

However I am at a new Dilemma now.

In my automation I am simply trying to lay the losers once there is an established winner (or there abouts). so once the loosing horses hit a specific price (odds) then also add in a historic relative odds condition the rule should kick in and then lay a runner say at a price of 30. but then when I have checked the automation the rule has kicked in and the odds it has matched at are like 2's for example.

how is this possible? if I have basically asked the automation to only lay at a price of say 30 after a trigger has seen the runner drift in that direction how can it get matched at 2's?

I know the price can move about depending on the horse performance but it should not match at 2 if I have asked it to lay at 30 right? ( have attached a screen shot of the logs of a race I had automation running on.

thanks again for your help here.

[Dallas]

The following post shows how best to set up a rule to trigger outside the current price
viewtopic.php?f=47&t=11621

To place lay bets on illiquid markets instead of using last traded price your best off using back price

You will always be matched at the best price so if someone pulls there lay bet at say 32 after your bet triggers and the next highest is 2.5 you will be matched at 2.5, but then if that runner wins you'll have saved a small fortune over being matched at 30+


Automation is just the same as manually betting except Bet Angel is placing the bets for you, but they are still bound by Betfairs rules, ie if Betfair doesn't allow in-play betting on a market that will apply to all types of bets even those placed directly on its own website.

[salmanim140i]

Once again Dallas Thanks for that.

I had totally seen where I was going wrong. had my plus/minus &less/greater the wrong way round. just gettng confused as when I am trying and i emphasises the word trying to manually trade on the horse I have the ladders reversed so my brain is stuck in that mode. (takes a bit of getting used to this)

But hopefully this is my final question for you today.

so I have changed up my tactic here slightly to do a lay bet offset with greening. instead of greening the field as this sometimes does not get matched (although it does show all green just different values, when watching the race I have the greenall box unchecked)

My question is. If a lay bet gets matched but it does not manage to match the offset bet, but my lay bet wins in that the horse does not win. do you still win a profit? as some times the race ends and the value is something silly like +£200 because I am assuming the automation did not manage to match the offset bet.

do you win that +£200 or do you win a smaller amount as the other runners all show a profit but a smaller value. (remembering the greenall box is still unchecked)

I had a look at the profit and loss report and it just shows the same values so when running an sum to work out profit and loss its just over inflated by all the other positive values?

is there a guide on how to understand the greening side of things.??

I would assume that it works like backing a horse. if that wins under normal bookie circumstances you win your bet. so if you lay and that obviously comes in then you win that profit right?

sorry for all the rookie/newbie questions. I have tried to find most of this info n here but there are 1000's f posts t ogo through to find it.

thanks again.