Any Professional Betfair Bettors/Traders Here?
I used Betfair for about six years and stopped as I wasn't getting anywhere with it. I traded mostly on horses. However, I returned to Betfair after a 2-year break and am actually winning more money on football these days. I have just been watching BetAngelTV and the football dutching video - very interesting - and it got me thinking that you could potentially make around £250/day, 7 days a week. Not bad. Then I got to thinking if there were any full-time Betfair traders going around - anybody know of any?
Without wishing to discourage you, if it were easy as falling off a log then more people would be doing it.oliver123 wrote:and it got me thinking that you could potentially make around £250/day, 7 days a week. Not bad.
My guess is that, for every trader who makes that kind of money, you have literally thousands of Betfair users who are unable to make £250 in a year, never mind a day...
Jeff
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convoysur-2
- Posts: 1110
- Joined: Thu Jan 12, 2012 10:00 am
yeah its got me thinking too,ive been at it 3 years now and im aprox £17.500 in the red ,
but i know im much better now because it takes me alot longer to lose my money now than 3 years ago,,,,
soon it will take me a whole month to lose a grand,,,,cant wait for that.....
but i know im much better now because it takes me alot longer to lose my money now than 3 years ago,,,,
soon it will take me a whole month to lose a grand,,,,cant wait for that..... -
convoysur-2
- Posts: 1110
- Joined: Thu Jan 12, 2012 10:00 am
yeah its got me thinking too,ive been at it 3 years now and im aprox £17.500 in the red ,
but i know im much better now because it takes me alot longer to lose my money now than 3 years ago,,,, soon it will take me a whole month to lose a grand,,,,cant wait for that.....
but i know im much better now because it takes me alot longer to lose my money now than 3 years ago,,,,
soon it will take me a whole month to lose a grand,,,,cant wait for that..... Wow thats a lot to lose.
I seem to recall the figure of 1% are profitable long term which on a customer base of 3.8m = 38,000
It would be interesting to know what the average daily profit is, but I doubt it would be as high as £250 (7.5K Month)
Also, When Betfair initially introduced the super PC, they quoted that only 500 customers would be affected ie 0.0131 %
The super elite (1 in a million) get a card and calendar at Christmas
Something to aim for!
I seem to recall the figure of 1% are profitable long term which on a customer base of 3.8m = 38,000
It would be interesting to know what the average daily profit is, but I doubt it would be as high as £250 (7.5K Month)
Also, When Betfair initially introduced the super PC, they quoted that only 500 customers would be affected ie 0.0131 %
The super elite (1 in a million) get a card and calendar at Christmas
Something to aim for!
Wd Respect i would of chilled out if i lost that amount of money. Have we people on here that when they lose money they dont care, ok its cost me say £6000 to learn courses etc blowing banks, if that was still going on i would of put this game down, maybe your doing something wrong.convoysur-2 wrote:yeah its got me thinking too,ive been at it 3 years now and im aprox £17.500 in the red ,
Whatever anyone says you can make a good few quid trading under strict dicipline and rules.
Its possible if you can trade for say £50 and run the race and hope the horse wins instaed of greening up, i tried this but itwas like just not thowing money away but hard brain thoughts to make that £50 go to waist, i green up always even if its £2.00PeterLe wrote:Wow thats a lot to lose.
I seem to recall the figure of 1% are profitable long term which on a customer base of 3.8m = 38,000
It would be interesting to know what the average daily profit is, but I doubt it would be as high as £250 (7.5K Month)
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andyfuller
- Posts: 4619
- Joined: Wed Mar 25, 2009 12:23 pm
Not greening up is pointless. You would therefore just be gambling based on no skill or judgement.
Over the long term you would expect to break even less commission. Assuming you don't go broke in the mean time when you hit the run of non of your greens winning and all your reds coming in. So make sure you have a massive bank roll if planning that approach.
Do a study of your results long term and you will see it is pointless. I did the study years ago and from that point onwards I never failed to green or red out a position.
The only case I see for it now is as an anti premium charge strategy.
Also don't consider green on the screen as free money to bet with, it is profit that you are throwing away, treat green just like you treat money in your pocket. The number of times I read over the years, oh I had some good green so I stuck a few quid on x horse. Makes no sense unless you have an edge for doing so. You may as well just do it all the time as opposed to when you have green.
Take away point, only bet when you have an edge. Which for most traders is never.
Over the long term you would expect to break even less commission. Assuming you don't go broke in the mean time when you hit the run of non of your greens winning and all your reds coming in. So make sure you have a massive bank roll if planning that approach.
Do a study of your results long term and you will see it is pointless. I did the study years ago and from that point onwards I never failed to green or red out a position.
The only case I see for it now is as an anti premium charge strategy.
Also don't consider green on the screen as free money to bet with, it is profit that you are throwing away, treat green just like you treat money in your pocket. The number of times I read over the years, oh I had some good green so I stuck a few quid on x horse. Makes no sense unless you have an edge for doing so. You may as well just do it all the time as opposed to when you have green.
Take away point, only bet when you have an edge. Which for most traders is never.
convoysur-2 wrote:yeah its got me thinking too,ive been at it 3 years now and im aprox £17.500 in the red ,
but i know im much better now because it takes me alot longer to lose my money now than 3 years ago,,,,
I think trading UK horse racing is about the hardest thing you can do. I'm in the red 10K, trying to trade UK Horse Racing over 3 years.
The really frustrating thing is that I can see all the patterns there, but just can't seem to make money out of them. If I sat down with Peter at the office, I'm pretty sure I could describe almost every trading pattern he knows about. But when I try to exploit... some one always gets in ahead of me, or the price gets pushed against me, I stop-loss.... only to have the price come back again. A very frustrating business all right.
There's the rub with pattern-based predictive trading.
The guys you're up against can also see the same patterns, and will often either get in before you or try to make the market act contrary to your expectations.
Prediction gives a comforting illusion of control, but little else. You'd probably do just as well tossing a coin.
Jeff
The guys you're up against can also see the same patterns, and will often either get in before you or try to make the market act contrary to your expectations.
Prediction gives a comforting illusion of control, but little else. You'd probably do just as well tossing a coin.
Jeff
Zenyatta wrote: The really frustrating thing is that I can see all the patterns there, but just can't seem to make money out of them. If I sat down with Peter at the office, I'm pretty sure I could describe almost every trading pattern he knows about. But when I try to exploit... some one always gets in ahead of me, or the price gets pushed against me, I stop-loss.... only to have the price come back again. A very frustrating business all right.
Logically, if the market prices are accurate, you will do no better or worse long-term from greening up vs having a situation where you profit if a particular horse wins but break even if it loses.andyfuller wrote:Not greening up is pointless. You would therefore just be gambling based on no skill or judgement.
As long as you have an expectation that your long-term average back will be higher than your average lay, it's not gambling.
Jeff
Welcome to the forum, fella
However, 1st post talking about £250 per day is something we've seen on here before. As Jeff rightly says - if it was a piece of piss, everyone would be doing it!
It's one of the reasons I have huge respect for PW. He's trying to sell his software when doing videos, but he never blinds people with bullshit about how much they can earn. He just shows how the software works, and how it can help you get a green screen
If you are novice, you will get the occasional £200+ day, but you'll have other days when you won't be able to sit down because you've had your ass pumped.
My advice is to start small, with just achieving regular green screens. Even if it's only 10p, that's a start. Understanding how markets work, and why prices move is more important in the early days than pure financial targets
However, 1st post talking about £250 per day is something we've seen on here before. As Jeff rightly says - if it was a piece of piss, everyone would be doing it!
It's one of the reasons I have huge respect for PW. He's trying to sell his software when doing videos, but he never blinds people with bullshit about how much they can earn. He just shows how the software works, and how it can help you get a green screen
If you are novice, you will get the occasional £200+ day, but you'll have other days when you won't be able to sit down because you've had your ass pumped.
My advice is to start small, with just achieving regular green screens. Even if it's only 10p, that's a start. Understanding how markets work, and why prices move is more important in the early days than pure financial targets
I've been hunting around to see if I can find some other easier form of gambling, get some relief from losing at trading. I'm looking at trying to become a pro poker player.Ferru123 wrote:
Prediction gives a comforting illusion of control, but little else. You'd probably do just as well tossing a coin.
Jeff
Read a fantastic poker book by Annie Duke ('Decide To Play Great Poker'). Highly recommended. Also watched heaps of late night poker shows ('The Big Game', 'Poker After Dark', Million Dollar Cash Game').
Lots of great names...Phil Hellmuth, Daniel Negreanu, Doyle Brunson, Tom Dwan, Phil Ivey.
Any way, started playing at PokerStars.net. Unfortunately took some bad beatings there as well. Then I realized...many of the same guys from this very forum (BetAngel) are playing poker online as well
