What exactly is betdaq supposed to do?! They've cut their commissions, they've advertised in the press (without a massive budget, they're not a huge company), everyone knows they're there. They have plenty of markets, they have an API and allow trading software. Money is there, the prices move.
What do people expect? Betdaq to send people round to their houses and hold their hands?! I always thought that people who become traders are more proactive than most people and ready to take charge of their own lives and decisions rather than looking to be lead by others. All most people seem to be doing here is moaning rather than looking for solutions. We're all peed off about the charge but we shouldn't make betfair into some sort of all encompassing demi-god which has complete control over our destiny (in our minds.)
We could sit here debating all the rights and wrongs and 'this might happen, that might happen' until the cows come home but thats not going to do anything postive for US, it is? We need to focus on solutions.
Instead of just striking tommorrow.....
Here are a few things for starters. 
viewtopic.php?f=16&t=4278
I agree that it's best to be solution-oriented though. All I was saying is that there's usually little point in helping someone who's unwilling to help themselves...
Jeff
viewtopic.php?f=16&t=4278
I agree that it's best to be solution-oriented though. All I was saying is that there's usually little point in helping someone who's unwilling to help themselves...
Jeff
hgodden wrote:What exactly is betdaq supposed to do?!
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spreadbetting
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People need to stop assuming everything is going to change overnight, I doubt we'll see any major impact to a poor Mondays racing even though plenty of threads will pop us telling us there were.
Betfair aren't going to back down they're far too stubborn to admit they're made a mistake. It'll be at least a year before any amendments are made to the PC.
I'll be spending Monday trying to port over my bots/strategies to betdaq because it's in my long and short terms interests to do so, but it'd be naive if we think they'll be some mass exodus.
Betfair aren't going to back down they're far too stubborn to admit they're made a mistake. It'll be at least a year before any amendments are made to the PC.
I'll be spending Monday trying to port over my bots/strategies to betdaq because it's in my long and short terms interests to do so, but it'd be naive if we think they'll be some mass exodus.
Some sense spoken there.spreadbetting wrote:I'll be spending Monday trying to port over my bots/strategies to betdaq because it's in my long and short terms interests to do so, but it'd be naive if we think they'll be some mass exodus.
My reason for moving over isn't to help effect change on Betfair. I really don't give a toss wether they succeed or fail. Betdaq is viable for me now. If it gets better great. I too don't see a massive improvement on Betdaq, that will be more gradual the more Betfair abuse it's clients.
RafterP wrote:I honestly dont think Betfair would care...
They seem to have steadily become more and more anti-trader over the past months and as I imagine most of their revenue comes from punters I dont think it will make any difference to Betfair if a handful of traders decide to take a day off.
Besides I dont think any of the really succesful traders will take a day off in protest. If I was one of them and earning around a £1,000 a day on average I think I would trade rather than sulk.
As for Betdaq would they really want all the traders coming over to them? They dont seem to be taking the oppurtunity to attract the disgruntled masses from Betfair. There must be a reason why Betfair dont seem to want the really high earning traders on board so I'd imagine Betdaq wouldnt really want them either.
May as well all just give up then,
Betfair don't want traders and in the future Betdaq
will not want them either, so whats the point learning
.So why are you here wasting your time ?
IMHO, the only way Betfair can be beaten (assuming the new PC doesn't cause them to self-destruct) is through legal action.
There's a case for saying that they are in breach of competition law (viewtopic.php?f=2&t=4295&p=30839&hilit=OFT#p30839), even though the OFT don't want to take it on.
Jeff
There's a case for saying that they are in breach of competition law (viewtopic.php?f=2&t=4295&p=30839&hilit=OFT#p30839), even though the OFT don't want to take it on.
Jeff
everyone just needs to let go and realise betfair is no longer the future. You need to let go and embrace the challenge of finding your own way on one of the other exchanges.
I will trade betdaq and occasionally betfair. I am actually quite upbeat about the whole thing. I know things are going on in the background with tech upgrades etc and I have a low rate of commission. There is absolutely no reason why betdaq cannot emerge as the dominant exchange out of this. Sure its not going to happen in the space of a week but over the next year there could be a significant shift. Betfair rose out of much smaller beginnings and peter and the other 500 pc3 players haven't done badly for themselves!
I will trade betdaq and occasionally betfair. I am actually quite upbeat about the whole thing. I know things are going on in the background with tech upgrades etc and I have a low rate of commission. There is absolutely no reason why betdaq cannot emerge as the dominant exchange out of this. Sure its not going to happen in the space of a week but over the next year there could be a significant shift. Betfair rose out of much smaller beginnings and peter and the other 500 pc3 players haven't done badly for themselves!
Exactly, the objective of this strike seems to be trying to get Betfair to do a u-turn over the PC3 ? 
Myself I dont really give a toss about what Betfair do from this point on, they have set out their stall and are clearly not the future of betting exchanges anymore.
People just need to except this and move on.
A Strike for a few days just will not work, you have to make a long term decision and the end objective should not be Betfair begging you to come back,
it should be YOU not needing Betfair anymore full stop imo.
Myself I dont really give a toss about what Betfair do from this point on, they have set out their stall and are clearly not the future of betting exchanges anymore.
People just need to except this and move on.
A Strike for a few days just will not work, you have to make a long term decision and the end objective should not be Betfair begging you to come back,
it should be YOU not needing Betfair anymore full stop imo.
Well Freddy I thought that was pretty obvious...freddy wrote:RafterP wrote:I honestly dont think Betfair would care...
They seem to have steadily become more and more anti-trader over the past months and as I imagine most of their revenue comes from punters I dont think it will make any difference to Betfair if a handful of traders decide to take a day off.
Besides I dont think any of the really succesful traders will take a day off in protest. If I was one of them and earning around a £1,000 a day on average I think I would trade rather than sulk.
As for Betdaq would they really want all the traders coming over to them? They dont seem to be taking the oppurtunity to attract the disgruntled masses from Betfair. There must be a reason why Betfair dont seem to want the really high earning traders on board so I'd imagine Betdaq wouldnt really want them either.
May as well all just give up then,
Betfair don't want traders and in the future Betdaq
will not want them either, so whats the point learning
So why are you here wasting your time ?
I'm not affected by the 60% PC so I can still make money from trading Betfair
It was pretty obvious yes,
and thats exactly the attitude alot of people will take unfortunatly and also the attitude Betfair are heavily relying on people taking.
It's up to individuals what they do of cause, but imo why give money to a company that you have already said don't like or want successful traders when presumably you want to be one in the future.
and thats exactly the attitude alot of people will take unfortunatly and also the attitude Betfair are heavily relying on people taking.
It's up to individuals what they do of cause, but imo why give money to a company that you have already said don't like or want successful traders when presumably you want to be one in the future.
The sad reality of the world we live in today is the "look after number 1" stance. It is plainly obvious that many of the short sighted traders that are happy to stay with Betfair "because it doesn't effect me......I can still make money" are secretly very happy that many of the "whales" are leaving, as they think they will have a better chance of winning. Even though Betfair themselves have already stated they will replace the liquidity with their Sportsbook.
What really annoys me, is many of the guys who now make a small amount of money as opposed to haemorrhaging money as they probably did at the start. (Who now couldn't give a toss about anyone but themselves) sneak around forums like this asking questions and getting advice from the Pro's who are good enough to give away their time and in some cases edge to help others.
In future I will be very careful who I help. If that's how it is...everyman for himself.
I once again want to back up what Jimrob & Freddy and some of the others have said. There is no point striking, it's a gradual or even full blown move over. I really don't care if no one moves Betdaq works as it stands, it will only get better.
Just one more thing. If you are a Loser now, that ain't gonna change, in fact it will only get worse with more Betfair manipulation.
What really annoys me, is many of the guys who now make a small amount of money as opposed to haemorrhaging money as they probably did at the start. (Who now couldn't give a toss about anyone but themselves) sneak around forums like this asking questions and getting advice from the Pro's who are good enough to give away their time and in some cases edge to help others.
In future I will be very careful who I help. If that's how it is...everyman for himself.
I once again want to back up what Jimrob & Freddy and some of the others have said. There is no point striking, it's a gradual or even full blown move over. I really don't care if no one moves Betdaq works as it stands, it will only get better.
Just one more thing. If you are a Loser now, that ain't gonna change, in fact it will only get worse with more Betfair manipulation.
The biggest concern for me will be if there is no real decline in volumes on Betfair. 60% has forced the hands of a lot of players to the point where no action isn't really an option. So if volumes do not delcline then I think that is a much more worrying scenario.
PW I have been thinking about the liquidity issue and trying to make sense of it. Would you agree that sometimes you get markets with high matched liquidity ie Tennis where 10Mil plus is common, but most is traded at 1.01 - 1.1. The back end is non existant. There are similar scenarios with racing (especially In Play).
Whatever the figures say there has been a massive change in the back end of the racing books. This gives an unbalance and skewed view.
Do you see this too? Or am I way off beat here?
Whatever the figures say there has been a massive change in the back end of the racing books. This gives an unbalance and skewed view.
Do you see this too? Or am I way off beat here?