EU Membership Referendum (Brexit)

[SweetLyrics]

There are all sorts of solutions, e.g. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-47047993

Yes, none of those solutions perfect, but as you rightly say, it looks like there will be border checks of some description in the event of 'No Deal' anyway, so it's not like the EU digging their heels in will keep the border completely frictionless.

[SweetLyrics]

'It is potentially a solution to an otherwise intractable problem [which is why the powers that be don't want to know]'

Nail on the head.

Suggestion: https://www.lbc.co.uk/radio/presenters/ ... -backstop/

[ruthlessimon]

he cant be taken to court and sent to prison if he goes back, asks for an extension and then veto's it because those are the rules under the European parliament as all 27 have to agree.

Surely that tempts ya to back No Deal? (or something correlated)

Problem is, whether he's actually bold enough to veto himself - is he genuinely that committed, I dunno. Maybe just before the summit lay No leave 31st - cos if he does veto, that'll spike like hell!! - & if he doesn't it'll be a fraction of a loss

I think he might just go for it.

Was just looking at A50 - what's interesting is paragraph 4

"For the purposes of paragraphs 2 and 3, the member of the European Council or of the Council representing the withdrawing Member State shall not participate in the discussions of the European Council or Council or in decisions concerning it."

I don't think he'd have a chance to veto

But I might still do it, (cos of Macron), although can we trust the French???

[greenmark]

Surely that tempts ya to back No Deal? (or something correlated)

Problem is, whether he's actually bold enough to veto himself - is he genuinely that committed, I dunno. Maybe just before the summit lay No leave 31st - cos if he does veto, that'll spike like hell!! - & if he doesn't it'll be a fraction of a loss

I think he might just go for it.

Was just looking at A50 - what's interesting is paragraph 4

"For the purposes of paragraphs 2 and 3, the member of the European Council or of the Council representing the withdrawing Member State shall not participate in the discussions of the European Council or Council or in decisions concerning it."

I don't think he'd have a chance to veto

But I might still do it, (cos of Macron), although can we trust the French???

?
Could you make that remark in the same room as a French friend?

[ruthlessimon]

Could you make that remark in the same room as a French friend?

Hell yeh I would go to Macron, & say:

"You're doing nothing more than further stoking uncertainty; & that's gonna kill my bank!! I'm fed up with this half arsed bad cop you froggy bastard - If you're gonna veto it, veto it - then I can lay No 31st with confidence!!!!"

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/ ... -extension
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/dith ... -dsbnvl0m6

[SweetLyrics]

It would be dangerous - it might provoke this response: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FWBUl7oT9sA

Could you make that remark in the same room as a French friend?

[SweetLyrics]

I'm not sure that the French would veto the extension, thanks to the fact that under the new bill, if the EU give us an extension that is way in the distant future, it can only be declined within 2 days of being offered, and with Parliament's consent.

The EU might therefore grant a (say) 4 year extension, potentially kicking Brexit deep into the long grass. By the time the extension is over, politicians might say 'It's been 7 years since the last vote. So much has changed. Let's hold another vote and restart the whole fun process again'.

[SilentDave]

"FRANCE was Britain's greatest ally during the Falklands war, providing secret information to enable MI6 agents to sabotage Exocet missiles which were desperately sought by Argentina, according to Sir John Nott, who was Defence Secretary during the conflict."

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews ... -Nott.html

You really shouldn't believe everything politicians tell you.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-17256975

[sionascaig]

I'm not sure that the French would veto the extension, thanks to the fact that under the new bill, if the EU give us an extension that is way in the distant future, it can only be declined within 2 days of being offered, and with Parliament's consent.

The EU might therefore grant a (say) 4 year extension, potentially kicking Brexit deep into the long grass. By the time the extension is over, politicians might say 'It's been 7 years since the last vote. So much has changed. Let's hold another vote and restart the whole fun process again'.

It suggested on the news last night that the EU had already been sounded out on a 3 month extension & had made warm noises - will find out soon enough )

PS: Thanks for your reply on border issues - was quite enlightening )

[BetBuddy]

If Boris doesn't send a UK EU commissioner to Brussels then we will be expelled by default under their rules. Or he can just tell them that the UK will veto everything the EU tries to do in the future. Under that statement, Macron will have us out quicker than you can say the word French.

[SweetLyrics]

Brexit news latest: EU will refuse delay in current circumstances, France warns
- https://www.standard.co.uk/news/politic ... 31506.html

Anyone else think that the odds on us leaving on 31/10 and on ND Brexit are way too high?

[superfrank]

The 2016 EU Referendum result
https://fullfact.org/online/referendum- ... stituency/

By constituency
406 Leave, 242 Remain

By constituency by party
Lab: 148 Leave, 84 Remain
Con: 247 Leave, 80 Remain

By MP:
160 Leave, 486 Remain

MPs voted for Article 50 and vowed to respect the referendum result but have since defaulted to simply representing themselves, hence the pickle we're in.

[greenmark]

Brexit news latest: EU will refuse delay in current circumstances, France warns
- https://www.standard.co.uk/news/politic ... 31506.html

Anyone else think that the odds on us leaving on 31/10 and on ND Brexit are way too high?

Javid on Andrew Marr this AM said they will obey the law. So since noone thinks the EU will cooperate, the only way we can leave on 31/10 is if the EU won't agree to a delay or BJ asks for a delay and then veto's it. I can't see any other options because everything else requires MP's to support ND and that question has been answered. At least until the next election and superfrank's stats on constituencis would imply a Tory majority if people vote as though its single issue election. Then its a done deal unless another swathe of Tory MP's rebel.

[SweetLyrics]

Javid on Andrew Marr this AM said they will obey the law.

It's all about whether they feel they are actually breaking the law.

If they feel the law itself is unlawful, then they might not regard not sending the letter as breaking the law.

Dominic Raab said this morning that they will test the law to the limit - https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-49625431.

The Supreme Court will possibly be asked to determine whether Parliament exceeded its powers (for example, by taking control of the parliamentary agenda without the government's consent, or interfering with the constitutional rights of the executive).

Also, it's possible that Boris will advise Her Majesty not to give Royal Assent to the bill, and that she will agree (given that kings and queens have traditionally gone with whatever advice their Prime Minister has given them). The last time this happened was in 1708, so I imagine that it may well go to the Supreme Court if that happens.

[SweetLyrics]

Ian Austin, Ex Labour MP, tears Jezza a new one!

https://twitter.com/LeaveEUOfficial/sta ... 8726793218